RSS usability sucks

At the Blog Business Summit yesterday we discovered just how bad RSS usability sucks. Molly Holzschalg was on stage with me and visited a blog and was trying to find its RSS feed. She couldn’t find it. Why? Cause there’s no consistency in this industry on how to subscribe.

Some sites use RSS icons. Most that I visit use the orange XML icon. But other sites don’t have any icon and instead use words like “subscribe” or “feed” or “web feed.”

Even others, like many Blogger sites, don’t have any icon or word with a link at all. For those you’ve gotta know to simply add “atom.xml” onto the end of the URL. Aaaaarrrrrrgggggghhhhhhh.

And then there’s sites like Dare Obasanjo’s. He’s a geek. Works at MSN. But look at the right side of his blog. He has four DIFFERENT icons for RSS. One for Yahoo. One for MSN. One for Bloglines. One for Newsgator.

Oh, I bet Jakob Nielsen is screaming right about now.

Whenever I hit problems like this I ask myself “what would Jeffrey Zeldman do?” Or WWJZD for short. :-)

Why Jeffrey? He’s still leading the Web design movement forward and is my favorite writer and speaker on the topic.

I find his minimalistic answer unsatisfying. He puts a text link in very small type at the bottom of his page.

My advice? Stick with the orange XML icon. Why? It sticks out. If the page Molly was trying to deal with yesterday had one of those she would have found it instantly. The BBC’s answer is actually pretty good too. They went with an Orange RSS button and next to it have a link to “What is RSS.”

In fact, I think that’s really the best answer: “just do what the BBC does.”

  • http://etgreen.wordpress.com/ etgreen

    Scoble, Zeldman has a text link in his sidebar. The text link at the bottom of the page is for validating his RSS, CSS, etc. When one clicks on “RSS Feeds” Zeldman gives a short page explaining what it is and how to use it.

  • http://etgreen.wordpress.com/ etgreen

    Scoble, Zeldman has a text link in his sidebar. The text link at the bottom of the page is for validating his RSS, CSS, etc. When one clicks on “RSS Feeds” Zeldman gives a short page explaining what it is and how to use it.

  • http://etgreen.wordpress.com/ etgreen

    Scoble, Zeldman has a text link in his sidebar. The text link at the bottom of the page is for validating his RSS, CSS, etc. When one clicks on “RSS Feeds” Zeldman gives a short page explaining what it is and how to use it.

  • http://fscklaw.com/ Matthew Goeden

    Apple’s Safari automatically detects if there is RSS links on your page and posts an RSS icon in the url bar.

    Doesn’t this seem like the logical place for RSS annoucement?!?! Even with a friendly orange icon on the webpage, you still have to search for it.

    Plus, the web browser is already decoding every line of html, etc. So, why not just have the browser detect it?!?!

    I imagine that a problem exists when multiple RSS feed links appear on the same page; however, I doubt this is very common — it hasn’t been for me, in fact, I have never had a problem and a subscribe to way-too-many blog feeds.

  • http://fscklaw.com/ Matthew Goeden

    Apple’s Safari automatically detects if there is RSS links on your page and posts an RSS icon in the url bar.

    Doesn’t this seem like the logical place for RSS annoucement?!?! Even with a friendly orange icon on the webpage, you still have to search for it.

    Plus, the web browser is already decoding every line of html, etc. So, why not just have the browser detect it?!?!

    I imagine that a problem exists when multiple RSS feed links appear on the same page; however, I doubt this is very common — it hasn’t been for me, in fact, I have never had a problem and a subscribe to way-too-many blog feeds.

  • http://fscklaw.com Matthew Goeden

    Apple’s Safari automatically detects if there is RSS links on your page and posts an RSS icon in the url bar.

    Doesn’t this seem like the logical place for RSS annoucement?!?! Even with a friendly orange icon on the webpage, you still have to search for it.

    Plus, the web browser is already decoding every line of html, etc. So, why not just have the browser detect it?!?!

    I imagine that a problem exists when multiple RSS feed links appear on the same page; however, I doubt this is very common — it hasn’t been for me, in fact, I have never had a problem and a subscribe to way-too-many blog feeds.

  • http://www.25hoursaday.com/weblog Dare Obasanjo

    This is already a solved problem. Within the next year or so, every modern web browser will have feed autodiscovery and this will be a moot discussion.

    At best you’re suggesting stopgap solutions which will likely be irrelvant when IE 7 ships.

  • http://www.25hoursaday.com/weblog Dare Obasanjo

    This is already a solved problem. Within the next year or so, every modern web browser will have feed autodiscovery and this will be a moot discussion.

    At best you’re suggesting stopgap solutions which will likely be irrelvant when IE 7 ships.

  • http://www.25hoursaday.com/weblog Dare Obasanjo

    This is already a solved problem. Within the next year or so, every modern web browser will have feed autodiscovery and this will be a moot discussion.

    At best you’re suggesting stopgap solutions which will likely be irrelvant when IE 7 ships.

  • http://fuffenz.webalbum.se/ Ulf Hedlund

    Most RSS readers will locate the feed if you just provide them with the blog’s URL. (at least if the blog system is clever enough to provide an “alternate” link tag with the “type” attribute set to “application/rss+xml”)

    The icon style isn’t really a problem, but there is another problem related to the feed. Maybe hard to believe, but not every visitor knows what RSS is. If such a user clicks the feed link, he will get the raw XML in his face. Not exactly user friendly. The feed should have a corresponding XML stylesheet providing a user-friendly page when the visitor clicks the feed link. It works with any decent browser and could display a brief tutorial on RSS and feed readers. Some blog systems provides this automagically, so does some third-party tools like Feedburner.

  • http://fuffenz.webalbum.se/ Ulf Hedlund

    Most RSS readers will locate the feed if you just provide them with the blog’s URL. (at least if the blog system is clever enough to provide an “alternate” link tag with the “type” attribute set to “application/rss+xml”)

    The icon style isn’t really a problem, but there is another problem related to the feed. Maybe hard to believe, but not every visitor knows what RSS is. If such a user clicks the feed link, he will get the raw XML in his face. Not exactly user friendly. The feed should have a corresponding XML stylesheet providing a user-friendly page when the visitor clicks the feed link. It works with any decent browser and could display a brief tutorial on RSS and feed readers. Some blog systems provides this automagically, so does some third-party tools like Feedburner.

  • http://fuffenz.webalbum.se Ulf Hedlund

    Most RSS readers will locate the feed if you just provide them with the blog’s URL. (at least if the blog system is clever enough to provide an “alternate” link tag with the “type” attribute set to “application/rss+xml”)

    The icon style isn’t really a problem, but there is another problem related to the feed. Maybe hard to believe, but not every visitor knows what RSS is. If such a user clicks the feed link, he will get the raw XML in his face. Not exactly user friendly. The feed should have a corresponding XML stylesheet providing a user-friendly page when the visitor clicks the feed link. It works with any decent browser and could display a brief tutorial on RSS and feed readers. Some blog systems provides this automagically, so does some third-party tools like Feedburner.

  • oj martin

    Safari sniffs out the rss on the home page and displays it in blue rectangle on the address line at the far right. Then just clicking on that blue rss rectangle the rss is automatically placed in the default rss reader in this case for me its called Newsfire. Then a simple return adds that feed to my reader. Just that simple. Click and return. Done!

  • oj martin

    Safari sniffs out the rss on the home page and displays it in blue rectangle on the address line at the far right. Then just clicking on that blue rss rectangle the rss is automatically placed in the default rss reader in this case for me its called Newsfire. Then a simple return adds that feed to my reader. Just that simple. Click and return. Done!

  • oj martin

    Safari sniffs out the rss on the home page and displays it in blue rectangle on the address line at the far right. Then just clicking on that blue rss rectangle the rss is automatically placed in the default rss reader in this case for me its called Newsfire. Then a simple return adds that feed to my reader. Just that simple. Click and return. Done!

  • http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView James Robertson

    If you are using an aggregator, you can almost certainly just ask it to subscribe to the main blog page – in which case it will do an auto-discovery and either subscribe or offer choices.

  • http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView James Robertson

    If you are using an aggregator, you can almost certainly just ask it to subscribe to the main blog page – in which case it will do an auto-discovery and either subscribe or offer choices.

  • http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView James Robertson

    If you are using an aggregator, you can almost certainly just ask it to subscribe to the main blog page – in which case it will do an auto-discovery and either subscribe or offer choices.

  • just

    use bloglines and livelines extension. preview feed if you are not sure.

  • just

    use bloglines and livelines extension. preview feed if you are not sure.

  • just

    use bloglines and livelines extension. preview feed if you are not sure.

  • http://edico.blogspot.com/ Stefan Constantinescu

    I don’t know why the icons are needed, with IE7 having a built in RSS auto discovery built in, what is the point?

  • http://edico.blogspot.com/ Stefan Constantinescu

    I don’t know why the icons are needed, with IE7 having a built in RSS auto discovery built in, what is the point?

  • http://edico.blogspot.com/ Stefan Constantinescu

    I don’t know why the icons are needed, with IE7 having a built in RSS auto discovery built in, what is the point?

  • http://blogs.msdn.com/ Alex Barnett

    I have all the logos on my blog. Why? Because the vast majority of those that use RSS don’t event know it. I use the generic XML logo for the RSS feed plus the ‘My MSN’ and ‘MY Yahoo’ icons for the vast majority of RSS subscribers that see the syndicated world as a ‘my’ application.

    This is a problem though and NOT solved as some suggest: saying IE7 will fix it is not the solution.

  • http://blogs.msdn.com/ Alex Barnett

    I have all the logos on my blog. Why? Because the vast majority of those that use RSS don’t event know it. I use the generic XML logo for the RSS feed plus the ‘My MSN’ and ‘MY Yahoo’ icons for the vast majority of RSS subscribers that see the syndicated world as a ‘my’ application.

    This is a problem though and NOT solved as some suggest: saying IE7 will fix it is not the solution.

  • http://blogs.msdn.com Alex Barnett

    I have all the logos on my blog. Why? Because the vast majority of those that use RSS don’t event know it. I use the generic XML logo for the RSS feed plus the ‘My MSN’ and ‘MY Yahoo’ icons for the vast majority of RSS subscribers that see the syndicated world as a ‘my’ application.

    This is a problem though and NOT solved as some suggest: saying IE7 will fix it is not the solution.

  • http://markallanson.net/ Mark Allanson

    The Australian Broadcasting Corporation (ABC) [Oz version of the BBC) does this quite well aswell. Here is there page describing what the XML icons etc mean: http://www.abc.net.au/news/services/default.htm .

  • http://markallanson.net/ Mark Allanson

    The Australian Broadcasting Corporation (ABC) [Oz version of the BBC) does this quite well aswell. Here is there page describing what the XML icons etc mean: http://www.abc.net.au/news/services/default.htm .

  • http://markallanson.net Mark Allanson

    The Australian Broadcasting Corporation (ABC) [Oz version of the BBC) does this quite well aswell. Here is there page describing what the XML icons etc mean: http://www.abc.net.au/news/services/default.htm .

  • Tetra

    Safari has the best solution yet with the auto-detection. Nice to see IE7 picking up on that. And by picking up, I mean copying the interface completely. Firefox and Opera should follow suit. It really is quite intuitive.

  • Tetra

    Safari has the best solution yet with the auto-detection. Nice to see IE7 picking up on that. And by picking up, I mean copying the interface completely. Firefox and Opera should follow suit. It really is quite intuitive.

  • Tetra

    Safari has the best solution yet with the auto-detection. Nice to see IE7 picking up on that. And by picking up, I mean copying the interface completely. Firefox and Opera should follow suit. It really is quite intuitive.

  • http://www.clrsql.com/weblog Randy H.

    The orange XML icon is outmoded and makes no sense. I’ve debated this with Dave W. over e-mail and he’s just plain wrong on this one.

    The orange XML icon doesn’t work for the following reasons:

    1. Users shouldn’t need to know what XML is- many of them will never understand that.
    2. The icon won’t make sense in many locales (don’t cite the Chinese People’s Daily- very lame example).
    3. Since the orange XML icon doesn’t actually help the user subscribe, it is at best an incomplete solution.

    I like Dare’s solution for having each “one-click” subscription option on his page. We need to have one-click subscriptions working consistently and a better way than the orange icon to identify where to click. If we do that, then we’ll have something useful.

  • http://www.clrsql.com/weblog Randy H.

    The orange XML icon is outmoded and makes no sense. I’ve debated this with Dave W. over e-mail and he’s just plain wrong on this one.

    The orange XML icon doesn’t work for the following reasons:

    1. Users shouldn’t need to know what XML is- many of them will never understand that.
    2. The icon won’t make sense in many locales (don’t cite the Chinese People’s Daily- very lame example).
    3. Since the orange XML icon doesn’t actually help the user subscribe, it is at best an incomplete solution.

    I like Dare’s solution for having each “one-click” subscription option on his page. We need to have one-click subscriptions working consistently and a better way than the orange icon to identify where to click. If we do that, then we’ll have something useful.

  • http://www.clrsql.com/weblog Randy H.

    The orange XML icon is outmoded and makes no sense. I’ve debated this with Dave W. over e-mail and he’s just plain wrong on this one.

    The orange XML icon doesn’t work for the following reasons:

    1. Users shouldn’t need to know what XML is- many of them will never understand that.
    2. The icon won’t make sense in many locales (don’t cite the Chinese People’s Daily- very lame example).
    3. Since the orange XML icon doesn’t actually help the user subscribe, it is at best an incomplete solution.

    I like Dare’s solution for having each “one-click” subscription option on his page. We need to have one-click subscriptions working consistently and a better way than the orange icon to identify where to click. If we do that, then we’ll have something useful.

  • http://blog.myspace.com/paulwheeler Paul Wheeler

    I think the underlying point is getting lost here and we’re nitpicking about feed icons again (how many times have we had this discussion?). The point of this post is that RSS usability sucks. It’s not just feed discovery, which as Dare points out is going to become, if it’s not already, a moot point (although I’m curious to see how the autodiscovery things deal with multiple RSS links on a page, javascript links, and other idiosyncrasies). What about trackbacks, viewing/posting comments from an aggregator, unified identity, blogs with only partial content in the description tag (*cough* SCOBLE *cough*), spam, archive naviagation, searching. We can rave about our various browsers autodiscovery, or our aggregators cool features, or our nifty orange feed icons until the cows come home. But on the whole, RSS usability *still sucks*! So what are we gonna do about it? Wait for Microsoft to proprietize it? Cause that’s why big companies proprietize things, because the community agreed upon standards suck (and if the standard itself doesn’t suck, then the documentation does).
    Don’t get me wrong, I like RSS/ATOM/syndycation/community standards, I’m just making a point.
    -Paul

  • http://blog.myspace.com/paulwheeler Paul Wheeler

    I think the underlying point is getting lost here and we’re nitpicking about feed icons again (how many times have we had this discussion?). The point of this post is that RSS usability sucks. It’s not just feed discovery, which as Dare points out is going to become, if it’s not already, a moot point (although I’m curious to see how the autodiscovery things deal with multiple RSS links on a page, javascript links, and other idiosyncrasies). What about trackbacks, viewing/posting comments from an aggregator, unified identity, blogs with only partial content in the description tag (*cough* SCOBLE *cough*), spam, archive naviagation, searching. We can rave about our various browsers autodiscovery, or our aggregators cool features, or our nifty orange feed icons until the cows come home. But on the whole, RSS usability *still sucks*! So what are we gonna do about it? Wait for Microsoft to proprietize it? Cause that’s why big companies proprietize things, because the community agreed upon standards suck (and if the standard itself doesn’t suck, then the documentation does).
    Don’t get me wrong, I like RSS/ATOM/syndycation/community standards, I’m just making a point.
    -Paul

  • http://blog.myspace.com/paulwheeler Paul Wheeler

    I think the underlying point is getting lost here and we’re nitpicking about feed icons again (how many times have we had this discussion?). The point of this post is that RSS usability sucks. It’s not just feed discovery, which as Dare points out is going to become, if it’s not already, a moot point (although I’m curious to see how the autodiscovery things deal with multiple RSS links on a page, javascript links, and other idiosyncrasies). What about trackbacks, viewing/posting comments from an aggregator, unified identity, blogs with only partial content in the description tag (*cough* SCOBLE *cough*), spam, archive naviagation, searching. We can rave about our various browsers autodiscovery, or our aggregators cool features, or our nifty orange feed icons until the cows come home. But on the whole, RSS usability *still sucks*! So what are we gonna do about it? Wait for Microsoft to proprietize it? Cause that’s why big companies proprietize things, because the community agreed upon standards suck (and if the standard itself doesn’t suck, then the documentation does).
    Don’t get me wrong, I like RSS/ATOM/syndycation/community standards, I’m just making a point.
    -Paul

  • http://dutch.hopto.org/ Niels

    This is kind of confusing, considering your opinion on the IE rss icon proposals a few weeks ago…

    I definitely agree though, RSS could use a usability boost, but I don’t think that icons, in whatever shape or form are going to solve it.

    The way I see it, it takes quite a bit for people to see the benefits of rss. Rss aggregators are too fragmented at this point. I wonder what it will take to make rss apple simple. Maybe some ‘love’ from MS.

  • http://dutch.hopto.org/ Niels

    This is kind of confusing, considering your opinion on the IE rss icon proposals a few weeks ago…

    I definitely agree though, RSS could use a usability boost, but I don’t think that icons, in whatever shape or form are going to solve it.

    The way I see it, it takes quite a bit for people to see the benefits of rss. Rss aggregators are too fragmented at this point. I wonder what it will take to make rss apple simple. Maybe some ‘love’ from MS.

  • http://dutch.hopto.org Niels

    This is kind of confusing, considering your opinion on the IE rss icon proposals a few weeks ago…

    I definitely agree though, RSS could use a usability boost, but I don’t think that icons, in whatever shape or form are going to solve it.

    The way I see it, it takes quite a bit for people to see the benefits of rss. Rss aggregators are too fragmented at this point. I wonder what it will take to make rss apple simple. Maybe some ‘love’ from MS.

  • http://kylecooney.wordpress.com/ kylecooney

    I disagree with the use of the orange XML button. I think letters XML should be replaced with a more general “Subscribe”. That button should take you to page with all of the sites subscriptions options(email, rss), as well as XML buttons with a description of RSS/XML feeds and a suggested preferred method to read them(google reader or bloglines, on my site). If you want, offer a simple link on the front page, right next to the Subscribe button that links powerusers automatically to the XML link.

    The only problem with this method is that it takes a lot of effort that most web projects aren’t likely to be willing to go through.

  • http://kylecooney.wordpress.com/ kylecooney

    I disagree with the use of the orange XML button. I think letters XML should be replaced with a more general “Subscribe”. That button should take you to page with all of the sites subscriptions options(email, rss), as well as XML buttons with a description of RSS/XML feeds and a suggested preferred method to read them(google reader or bloglines, on my site). If you want, offer a simple link on the front page, right next to the Subscribe button that links powerusers automatically to the XML link.

    The only problem with this method is that it takes a lot of effort that most web projects aren’t likely to be willing to go through.

  • http://kylecooney.wordpress.com/ kylecooney

    I disagree with the use of the orange XML button. I think letters XML should be replaced with a more general “Subscribe”. That button should take you to page with all of the sites subscriptions options(email, rss), as well as XML buttons with a description of RSS/XML feeds and a suggested preferred method to read them(google reader or bloglines, on my site). If you want, offer a simple link on the front page, right next to the Subscribe button that links powerusers automatically to the XML link.

    The only problem with this method is that it takes a lot of effort that most web projects aren’t likely to be willing to go through.

  • http://en.chunkyasparagus.org/ Doug

    To Dare Obasanjo, Stefan, Tetra et al,

    Yes, most browsers and readers will have auto-discovery built in, but that’s not all RSS feeds are used for. What if you want to add the feed to Google Reader or netvibes? The point of having an easy-to-find icon or link is that you have a direct way to pick out the link without the need for special software.

    As for Zeldman’s site, yeah there is a link in the sidebar, but I couldn’t find it for ages, and the fact that Robert couldn’t find it either is an example of exactly why we need the easy-to-find icon.

  • http://en.chunkyasparagus.org/ Doug

    To Dare Obasanjo, Stefan, Tetra et al,

    Yes, most browsers and readers will have auto-discovery built in, but that’s not all RSS feeds are used for. What if you want to add the feed to Google Reader or netvibes? The point of having an easy-to-find icon or link is that you have a direct way to pick out the link without the need for special software.

    As for Zeldman’s site, yeah there is a link in the sidebar, but I couldn’t find it for ages, and the fact that Robert couldn’t find it either is an example of exactly why we need the easy-to-find icon.

  • http://en.chunkyasparagus.org/ Doug

    To Dare Obasanjo, Stefan, Tetra et al,

    Yes, most browsers and readers will have auto-discovery built in, but that’s not all RSS feeds are used for. What if you want to add the feed to Google Reader or netvibes? The point of having an easy-to-find icon or link is that you have a direct way to pick out the link without the need for special software.

    As for Zeldman’s site, yeah there is a link in the sidebar, but I couldn’t find it for ages, and the fact that Robert couldn’t find it either is an example of exactly why we need the easy-to-find icon.

  • http://jeremy.zawodny.com/blog/ Jeremy Zawodny

    Could we stop talking about “RSS” or “XML” and speak in terms that normal people can be expected to understand?

  • http://jeremy.zawodny.com/blog/ Jeremy Zawodny

    Could we stop talking about “RSS” or “XML” and speak in terms that normal people can be expected to understand?