Arguing about how to bring computing to poor

They’d rather have a cell phone than a big computer. Why?
Cause girls like to talk – and they don’t like geeks !

One thing I see about ‘computing to poor’ efforts is that most of them are run by academics and government institutions…
It’s a lot more about pride and status than a technical solution. If you ask someone to choose between a $100 ‘laptop for the poor’ or a $100 cell phone, even without many features…most of them would choose the cell phone. And the other way around would happen if you change the labels and call it the $100 ‘cell phone for the poor’.
Here in Brazil you can see that in many different ways. The ‘poor’ that can’t buy a $1000 computer, but has bought 2 pairs of nice snickers for $500 each…
Why? Because he can’t show his “computer for the poor” around the neighborhood.

I don’t think it is a case of either a laptop or phone. Most kids I know have a phone and access to a pc at home, be it desktop or laptop.

As for the cultural differences between the USA and Europe, I don’t think it is as straightforward as you make out.

Whilst you might not have seen lots of people messing around with laptops in London that deson’t mean we don’t have them – we just use them less in public places. Most people in the UK I know have at least 1 desktop and often a laptop AND always a mobile phone. My wife is from the USA and when I go there I see much less PC usage than here – but she is from the midwest.

I don’t think there is 1 USA culture, there’s lots of them – the same goes for Europe. Just because you haven’t witnessed lots of laptop usage in the UK doesn’t mean we own mobile phones but not PCs we have both.

I think in the US, people are fatter and their sheer girth creates a laptop-usable clearing. So, they can use a laptop. Leaner people share the public space and use the trimmed down cell phone to communicate.

Really, it’s true!

A device similar to the one held by BillyG at WinHEC, a small Tablet with a network connection.

Jake: that has to be the lamest thing I’ve ever seen posted here. Congratulations! It’s not easy coming up with something so lame.

I’m from India, and did a bunch of surveys among “middle class families” last year on why they’d purchase a computer.

The main reason to buy a computer was: it will help kids in their education. (the second was “it will help me at work”).

For the large middle class in India, a computer (education) represents something very different than a cell phone (talking to friends). Kids will more easily be able to get a computer (than a cell phone) from their parents, even though a computer may be more expensive.

The poor in India cannot afford a $1000 computer. In many places there are no regular phones. For them, a cell phone is awesome because they can communicate. Often, a cell phone is shared among multiple people (like in a village).

My point: The aspirations attached to and the basic functionality of these devices are different. In my opinion, in countries such as India – a traditional computer, if made less expensive, will deliver computing power to those who need it better than a beefed up cell phone. Cell phones too will continue to do well, but by embracing less expensive call rates, a wider network and easy / simple games and apps (not high computing power).

Jake, that was stupid. Not everyone in the U.S. is fat either.

People in less-developed countries use cells because land-line infrastructures are more costly to build. Kids rather have cells because they want to have fun socializing and be trendy.

Problems with cells (vs. computers): 1) poor inputting device that limits so many learning activities such as composing essays, doing science homework, etc, which computers have definite advantages over; 2) cell phone’s so-called “text communication capability” tchs stnts 2 b hip not b smart; 3) cell phones offer headlines not details; 4) a cell phone costs, on average, $49/month, which comes out to about $600 a year (here in the U. S.). Cheap but fully equipped computers and laptops nowadays can be had for $600, sometimes even less during holiday sales; offer people credits and extended-payments and computers cost about the same as cells.

But rather than argue about how to bring computing to the poor – let’s just do it!

The more competition the better. Let’s see who gets there first.

Hmm. This just begs the question – How hard is it to install Linux on an average phone? I mean, some of those things have more processing power then my last laptop. (Yes, I know. I need to upgrade more often.)

It makes absolutely no sense that computers or cell phones for the poor run Microsoft products instead of free software.

Networking: IT training a retention issue
CHICAGO, Jan. 30 (UPI) — Training and education of experienced IT professionals already established in the workforce is becoming a major concern, one certain to be on the consciousness of senior management at corporations all over the United States in the coming year, experts tell United Press International’s Networking.

A survey, released last week by the Computing Technology Industry Association (CompTIA), a trade association for the IT industry, based in Oakbrook Terrace, Ill., in suburban Chicago, indicates that workers are taking the initiative to get the new training and skills they need for their careers, and that employers, thus far, are not providing guidance as to what skills they want for the future. By Gene Koprowski

“Networking: IT training a retention issue
CHICAGO, Jan. 30 (UPI) — Training and education of experienced IT professionals already established in the workforce …”

Who is “Ted Smith” and WTF is he and UPI up to — blog comment spam?

Does anyone research or even think before they post around here? It is getting worse than Slashdot…

I am going from memory but the $1,000 laptop Scoble is referring to is just pure and utter FUD, the MIT developed “laptop” is something that will be developed for a cost under $100 and isn’t really a laptop at all and is a small computing device that has a decent sized screen & keyboard, cell based wireless networking (so with one device located every X miles they can all hook up so it is like instant infrastructure) and has a built-in crank so it can generate it’s own power.

How in the heck is a cell phone that would need to connect to a TV and external keyboard (apparently that was part of Bill’s plan) going to compete with such a device? Bill’s plan might work better for a different class of poor like here in the USA but it isn’t even in the same league as the MIT developed device when it comes to third world countries.

Why does it have to be either/or? Put your money where your mouth is BillG.

Nicholas Negroponte is just an idealistic utopiaistic nuthead, feel good liberal without a clue.

But Microsoft handing out cellphones to the poor? Well, I guess that might be the only way to make SmartPhone take off. Instead of creating a platform, Windows Mobile can be a charity. But why not go middle-way, and give away all those old Pocket PCs no one wants…but then the power problem.

I’m glad jaseone can read. Scoble, did you read your own companies plan or did you just find this by following Rothman’s post? Your boys want cellies to be linked to TVs, FREAKIN TVs!.

Lame, yes. Maybe more lame than usual for me. Lamest ever? Well I would be honored. But not as lame as the miraculous 8 year old memory of the cell phone user on the rickety bicycle in China. Or assuming people in London do not use computers because you didn’t see them using computers.

Lucas Persona and Arun Rajappa made some excellent comments.

The survey methodology and presentation of “a computer for the poor” vs ” a cell phone” could incline one to choose the cell phone. Who wants to be identified as needing a computer for the poor?

The distinction between the value changing ability and aspirations associated with a cell phone and a computer to a struggling middle class is also very interesting. It makes you wonder: does Walmart sell more computers or more pay-as-you-go minutes?

In this country, a cell phone is generally a personal device. In many homes, a computer is a shared device. If you asked a kid if they’d rather have a cell phone or a computer, I’d guess a cell phone seems more likely to be their possession. Why go for the computer if the computer is shared?

It doesn’t take long for the cell phone to cost more than the computer. You can play the game anyway you want (it’s a $1000 computer, not a $100 computer, not a $500 computer), but the monthly recurring charges on a cell phone will cost more than the computer in a period of time.

give us a screen the size of a paperback,
with a phone _and_ a computer inside
– with a complete operating system –
and full web access (through the phone,
if necessary), and sell it for $300-$400
(plus the monthly charge for the phone),
and see how many people pass that up.

of course, at that price, you could not
use an o.s. from microsoft, could you?

-bowerbird

bowerbird, since this is intended for everyone to tribal Africans who have never used a computer to Indians in South America to Aboriginis to the poor Chinese living deep in the interior to Pakistanis who are freezing because they are homeless because of earthquakes, I suspect a lot of folks would turn down your $400 mini-Tablet (which can’t be built at that price).

A device that will change the lifestyle of people in Africa or Asia has to be invented by the people there itself.
Not by people who live somewhere far away who probably has no clue as to what goes on anywhere else.

Am not saying these efforts will go waste. But if such a gadget is developed, then it should be flexible enough to be tweaked by the users for their own needs. And I don’t see Microsoft marketing such a device.

There is no difference between a cellphone and a computer. There were computers that were slower than todays cellphones and were put to great use.

So instead of trying to come up with solutions. Try and identify the problems first. What are the problems they usually face? What can poor people do with computers?
Anyone?

The basic concept here is: let’s do something for the kids in the poorest of the poor areas.

Now picture this: a classroom of 60 in an Afghan village; 1/3 of them walk for miles to get there every morning; 1/3 do not have breakfast; 1/3 rarely have dinner. Then Bill Gates walks in and announces, “I’ve got the solution for your education – here is a cell phone, a TV, a keyboard; hook them up and you’re on information autobahn!”

This is not to say Nicholas Negroponte has the answer either. Here is a man whose brother is John Negroponte, the National Intelligence Czar appointed by Bush. Although these two brothers might not share the same political ideology, but Nicholas Negroponte’s idea of fixing problems for the poor reeks “let them eat chocolate” kind of rich man’s mentality.

I don’t fault either man for trying, but some of their proposals are just materials for bad sketches on late-night comedy shows. They should simply do the easiest – buy a bunch of computers, truck them over to the schools in poor areas, and set them up for them.

Why do you hate the poor so much that you want to foist computers on them? Do they not have enough trouble?

The MIT laptop totally makes sense and what I love about it is it puts all commercial computers at risk. Windows is a closed system. So is OS X (although a lot more of its source is available).

The goal is to provide a system with FULL SOURCE CODE that will allow the users to make something TRULY ORIGINAL OF THEIR OWN.

The problem with Windows is MS expects me to be a consumer/audience. OS X is a bit better but it assumes I produce media/content.

What makes MS or Apple think their shiny boxes relate in any way to the people in emerging nations? Cell phones are no better. They do what they do but you can’t make them do anything new.

The $100 computer is CHEAPER than Scoble’s cell phone, does more, and will be completely open to learn from. Its the old give em fish or fishing poles argument. Negroponte is opting for the poles.

I’m sorry that MS isn’t going to get to use it to lock people into the MS way of doing things so they can extract license fees in the future but this is really in the best interest of the eventual users. It would be nice if you could acknowledge this.