Better mail than jail

by on March 4, 2006

Drew Bell unsubscribes.

Roy Schestowitz unsubscribes and goes even further: “[Scoble's] reputation is overrated. When it comes to technology, I found that Scoble cannot tell his ass from his face.”

My reply? First I want to reply to a couple others he made. The reason I’m on WordPress is cause Matt Mullenweg won a contest I held a few months back (he’s the guy who developed Wordpress). Not to mention that it was getting talked up a LOT by people who I trust (and still is). Oh, and I LIKE Matt Mullenweg and the folks he’s been hiring. Just like I like the folks over at Six Apart (my book blog is on TypePad). And just like I like the folks over at MSN Spaces (my wife’s blog is on that).

The second thing of Roy’s I’d like to reply to is his link to an article that says that there’s a back door in Vista. This is absolutely NOT true. I have been interviewing tons of people in the BitLocker team about that article and I’ll have the video up soon.

It’s amazing the kinds of rumors that get started and just how much effort needs to be spent trying to fight rumors that are totally not true (and, if any technologist spends five minutes THINKING they can see why putting a back door into source code is just NOT a good idea. But the “Microsoft is evil” view of the world is just not conducive to doing some critical thinking).

It’s a lot easier to call Microsoft advocates names and say they are lying and are corporate shills and all that. Or imply it by just saying I don’t know my face from my behind.

Regarding my skills as a technologist. I’ve done more than 500 video interviews that are all in the public eye and mostly unedited and filmed in one take — most of which are an hour long and have a lot of back and forth and I NEVER prepare, so all the questions are off the top of my head (except for the Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer ones, where I went in with a list of questions and then went impromptu halfway through each of those interviews). With diverse subjects and interviewees from Kernel architects to Xbox game developers to hardware designers to beer makers.

You try doing that many interviews with that diverse a set of technologists without knowing the difference between my ass and my face. But, just proves the old adage that you can’t please everyone all of the time no matter what you do.

That said, no, I don’t write software so if we’re gonna get into that kind of pissing match, I’ll lose. Doesn’t mean I don’t know enough to at least know the issues. I worked as an associate editor at Visual Basic Programmer’s Journal for a few years and learned quite a bit about software engineering back then (and, a lot since then too).

Personally I’m glad that Roy is an advocate for non-Microsoft technologies. I’d hate it if he was using these kinds of tactics on our side of the fence.

If I ever see a Microsoft advocate treat someone advocating another platform this way I’ll personally rail on them. That’s not a tactic that’s acceptable.

What do you think? Does this kind of tactic persuade you to switch operating systems?

  • met
    There are techies who dis anyone who isn't a techie (defined as who make the tech). Not me and a lot of other people, I believe.

    No matter what you do or what he does, will persuade me to change anything (I believe)

    What could happen is - if I believe that MS listens to me (thru you), I might take an active interest and check out its products (which I wouldn't have otherwise).
    I am not sure if you can make MS change, but if you can make it listen to us, that will be more than enough.

    One thing that pisses me off is - you try to sugar techies like you would others. I love techies because they are cute, because they are devoted, blah, blah.... I don't know if it works on some of us, but it irritates me.
    Please don't try to be one of the techies, be what you are, stick around, help us, show us stuff, etc. :)
  • met: fair enough. But from my point of view, that's not sugar. It's how I feel. Ask anyone who I've met and they'll tell you that's a genuine response on my side. Start with the two guys I met yesterday.
  • met
    I should have re-read it before submitting :)
    Hope the message gets thru.
  • Oh, and regarding persuasion. I've had more than a few people come up to me and say that I persuaded them to buy a new phone, or a new Tablet PC, so I know that I've gotten a few people to try out something new.
  • Mike Sanlon
    Mebbe it's your interview style. There's countless examples where you ask basic questions. "What is a pivot table?" or "What is Biztalk"- I understand that you are doing it for the benefit of others but mebbe this is lost on Mr Schestowitz. He is an educated man - but he appears to miss the point.

    You are pretty good at striking a balance in the Channel 9 interviews so that non-developers can still take away something from them.

    Also, I defie anyone to know the intimate details of all Microsoft products. Frankly, there are too many of them for one person to have a complete grasp of everything.

    I got your book by the way, it was much better than I expected. It has made me think about how Blogs can help me in my own business. I'm at the reading other blogs part, and as mentioned in your book, the scariest thing to me right now is finding the time to put decent content up there on a very regular basis.
  • Fair comments. No, that sort of pig-headedness doesn't convince me to switch. I like LISP despite the morons who frequent the newsgroup. I like PHP despite the fact that the median age of PHP "gurus" is twelve. I like Apache despite the fact that whoever designed and/or documented mod_rewrite should be executed for crimes against simplicity. And - perhaps most significantly - I really really don't ever want to work with .NET and ASP in a commercial setting, even though I love the idea of the CLR and I agree with the generally unanimous wisdom that Anders Howdoyouspellitberg is the third smartest man in computerdom (have to allow for McCarthy and Stallman, of course!).

    Short form: there are absolute unmitigated gits in every endeavour. The only crime I can't forgive is a refusal to learn, but not every bad apple spoils the whole barrel.

    Incidentally, the net effect of wallies like Roy, and of your slightly smug but thoroughly justified response, is that I have slightly more respect for Microsoft's people. Still don't like the software and more, but it wasn't the software that was rude.
  • Mike: exactly. Not everyone (even software developers) know all the terms and all the concepts. Heck, I've had kernel developers say they appreciate my style. They don't always keep up on everything happening in, say, Xbox land.
  • Eric: no problem, we'll be here to help if you ever wanna try. You might be suprised at how good our latest stuff is. I have the advantage of being told that by our customers (you'll hear some really suprising stories coming out of Mix06).
  • Mike Sanlon
    Totally Off Topic, but are you ever going to get around to talking to the Class Server team? They are doing some interesting things with Sharepoint and I think the whole Education Division of Microsoft is undersold on Channel 9.
  • Mike: I haven't made any plans with that team yet. Do you know someone on that team?
  • I also sometimes think that Microsoft would be better off to fire Scoble and concentrate on product development more instead, but then all of a sudden I realize that who would then promote my beloved Windows Mobile phonez in the blogo-fucking-sphere?
  • Mike Sanlon
    Robert: Sorry, I don't know anyone. I have just set up Class Server in a couple of schools who are my customers. (They all want Tablet PC's by the way, but won't be getting any while Dell is selling laptops for $499 - and thus I watch the whole Origami meme with genuine interest)
  • Scoble rocks =D

    I guess his interview style / blog writing style / personallity suits different people. I've learnt a lot through Scoble and find that during interviews he has a good balance between humor and finding out stuff for us. I agree that IT pros as well as developers can get a lot from his interviews. His blogging style goes straight to the point where hot topics are concerned and provides good linkage. Keep it up! :-)
  • toast
    In checking out schestowitz's post, I thought I was reading something written by someone who considers himself and his ideas to be ideogically pure and above those that might work for a company that charges money for its software and services (god forbid it if that company is Microsoft).

    I was amazed at his almost completely arrogant tone toward Robert (and everyone else who works for Microsoft) and felt as though I was reading a nonsensical thread on /. by some anonymous troll.

    From what I see, Robert has friendships and relationships and dialog with a very diverse range of people in IT, on the fringe of IT and outside of IT. He has a balanced and pragmatic eye for technology and the benefits it can bring to humans. He has enthusiasm in abundence.

    All this other person has done is spout and throw stones. If he was the technologist and community minded person he claims to be, he would have contacted Robert and opened a dialog a long time ago. Why? Because this is what people do when they share a passion.

    Keep up the fantastic work, Robert. This other person, like so many others out there, just can't get past his own ego.
  • Mike
    "This is absolutely NOT true. I have been interviewing tons of people in the BitLocker team about that article and I’ll have the video up soon."

    Prove it. How? Open the source code. If you know about crytopgraphy, you know you don't have to show everything for someone to trust you. Don't want to open the source code? Fine, then stop pretending (I don't trust you so I don't take any word for granted) and shut up.

    You think posting a video is going to fix the problem. It's understandable you are trying to use your tools to fix problems, i.e. a camera, but that kind of subject is way more convoluted than it looks like. You can easily go as far as saying that, because Microsoft holds the source code, every single protocol is a potential backdoor. Again, if you go down this path, you'll end up saying "you are either with us, or against us". Does it sound familiar?
  • Fernando
    Mike, the burden of the proof should be on the side of those claiming such "backdoor" exist. Do you have any evidence of this backdoor?

    And FYI: the Windows source code *is* shared with more than 40 national governments through the Government Security Program (http://www.microsoft.com/resources/sharedsource...), including Russia and China. Now you tell me how Microsoft will sneak a backdoor in the source code - or maybe finally shut up.
  • Mike
    Fernando, you completely side step the issue. Microsoft is the implementation provider here, so they must gain trust from us. As for companies who have licensed the source code, do you mean to imply that those companies have indeed full-proofed that there is no backdoor? Why is it that I think that's as ridiculous as it can be.
  • Scoble,

    I think the reason you catch a lot of flak is become no, you're not a programmer, so a lot of hackers view you as pretty low on the food chain.

    But wait, you get your own popular blog, and video equipment, and you get to travel, and talk to cool hackers ... so you just completely through the food chain out of wack. So basically most people are just pissed because you're mostly part of the crowd that consumes technology instead of creating it, yet you still get all the requisite perks.
  • Brian
    His comments were snarky and ill-tempered and you don't have to defend yourself -- as you point out, your body of work speaks for you. That said...

    I am a little curious about your use of Wordpress. In the "eating our own dog food" spirit, aren't there MS technologies you could use where your blog could be a proof of concept for readers to evaluate? For example, I'm developing blogs for my company in dotnetnuke because we want to stay .Net centered and aren't ready yet for Sharepoint. It would be great to know what else is available in that ecosphere.
  • Jake
    Have there ever been back doors in any Microsoft operating system?
  • Fernando
    Mike, *you* are side stepping the issue. Please answer me: how Microsoft will sneak a backdoor in the source code that is shared with 40 foreign governments and hundreds of companies worldwide? Then you can go back to your conspiracy theory.
  • Oleg
    Mike: What proof do you have that Linux does not have backdoors? Have you personally checked its kernel and all components on top of it? For that matter, do you think any company using it has checked it?

    If you don't trust Microsoft, don't use its products. It's that simple. What's funny is that for last N years, you and others have been using OSes w/o such functionality and never worried about your private data being accessed by foreign or your own governments.
  • Brian - Oh man, if you want a .NET blog (free, open-source, and developed by some fairly incredible .NET developers in their own time), use dasBlog - http://www.dasblog.net
  • Greg Hughes
    As with everyone, my typical reactions to the kind of stuff Roy says in his post has changed over time. Early in my blog-reading life, I would have laughed and maybe commented about it on his blog, or on mine.

    Today I'm abstracted another layer or two, but I still read a lot of the same blogs. I'm especially glad for the opportunity to find out why not to hire this guy, even before he ever applies for a job (theoretically, of course).

    Write enough like that in the public domain and it never really goes away. The reason hiring managers don't read technical dissertations that accompany certain resumes is because it's time consuming and hard (and boring, often pretentious, and typically irrelevant). When he finishes his PhD, chances are much better that hiring managers will read his blog than look at his scholastic record. And that will tell them what they really need to know - what kind of a person are they hiring? And if they don't look, well they deserve him then.

    At least he'll have more time to moderate for Slashdot.

    Oops. Too snarky? Anyhow, everyone reads your blog (or any blog for that matter) for their own reasons. That's the beauty of it. That's half of what makes it personal, and I think we all know it's the personality, however flawed, that makes it really worth while. Someone I know wrote something about that, I think.

    Still subscribed.
  • Brian
    Greg thanks for the info on dasBlog. I had looked at it briefly but was scared off because it's developed in C# and I am but a lowly VB guy [shields eyes, skulks off to the shadows...]
  • Andy
    The one thing I would like on channel 9 is something like the new Windows Vista audio controls so I can control laughter volume seperately to speech volume.
  • Mike
    "If you don’t trust Microsoft, don’t use its products. It’s that simple."

    How? My employer uses Microsoft software, how can I as an employee avoid them since the computers at work are not mine?
    Give me the solution, smarty.

    " What’s funny is that for last N years, you and others have been using OSes w/o such functionality and never worried about your private data being accessed by foreign or your own governments."

    That's gratuitous.
  • Windows Source Code is viewed by more than 15 million people every year. Probably more than look at Linux's core kernel code.

    As far as blogging, the biggest reason Scoble chose Wordpress was that he wanted a Hosted solution. There simply weren't any decent ones running on Windows technologies. Plus, Scoble is a User. He wants what's best for him. He doesn't often choose things ideologically. He chooses them because he believes they are best for him.
  • The "regarding my skills as a technologist" section does nothing but affirm my dislike of your interviews. One would think that an accomplished technologist would research the subject of the interview, write appropriate questions that his target audience might be interested in, and keep the interviews SHORT. It is quite frankly a waste of my time to watch an entire interview of yours. Maybe that's not the 'naked conversations style', but whatever it is, this style is not effective for video interviews.
  • Don
    I am willing to try your job for a week. Then they'll see how smart you are. Funny thread, but clean out the really bad words like Beatle Bailey would so you don't look propogate words like ^&(^%^)( any more.
  • Just a thought here, Robert, if you don't mind showing your hand a bit. Post here *before* you do these interviews and get good interview questions. Then you can whittle through them and pick the best ones to mix with questions of your own.

    You have an audience and you say you appreciate the reader feedback so why not put the two together to improve your interviews?
  • Oleg
    How? My employer uses Microsoft software, how can I as an employee avoid them since the computers at work are not mine?
    Give me the solution, smarty.

    Very simple, again. Quit the job if you don't like to use the software. Or understand that whatever you do at work belongs to your employer anyway - and as such, your concerns about privacy/backdoor are not that important. Unless you are an employer and concerned about it. But then, you would need to be concerned about it during all those years you've been using Windows anyway.

    The circle of trust, huh.

    Pick your battles and try not to mask your lack of understanding of the situation behind the obfuscated view of the world developed by reading blogs by Microsoft haters.

    Not that it really matters to you, though.
  • Greg, my boss uses Das Blog. As Jeremy says, it's not appropriate for me. MSN Spaces might be, but I can't stand the designs used over there and the HTML isn't nice and and and.
  • Why do people attack Scoble with hate? You can come up with a thousand reasons--and the haters justify it by saying Microsoft is evil, so anything they do or say is fully justified.

    But the true reason they attack and insult is: to feel better about themselves. They have a hole in their soul somewhere. So they hurl insults against a blogger who poses no threat to them whatsoever. It's the subconsious rearing up to protect itself from self-loathing. Unfortunately, it is a hole they can never fill. So they keep on attacking and they never feel truly satisfied, never more than a few moments anyway.
  • Brian
    I second TDavid's suggestion -- it would fit right in with the spirit of Channel 9, which is to promote greater transparency and connection between MS developers and the people who use the software.
  • /pd

    Life is like a baboons Ass-Colorful and full of shit!!

    either Way, if the end makes your all right it would not make diference. trying to do the right thing and if things god wrong, 10 angels swearing that you were trying to do the right thing would make no difference.

    So in short, life sucks- suck it up. There are 100 and 1000's of folks who will have different thoughts on what, why and which.. does it really matter ?? What matters to the communiyt is that you are passionate, authorative and just a plain joe blow who blogs well... if you working for some small sweat shop plumber down the road and wrote like you did, I'll still take your feed. !!
  • I fell for Schestowitz's little ploy by clicking on the link to his blog. By railing on Scoble the net effect was Schestowitz's web counter probably tripled from the linking. This leech-like ploy reminds me of the leeches that sit on the back of a humpback whale, since they can't get their own food they latch on to something else to gain their "sustenance".

    You see, Schestowitz can't create his own readership, so he goes searching for a target big enough to create controversy and therefore bump up his stats. There wasn't anything of real substance in Roy's "blog entry" except the name "Robert Scoble". Take that out and what kind of readership would there be? That to me is the test of an entry, hence why I see Roy as a leech.

    I read Scoble to be turned onto new technologies, whether they be OS, phones, blog tools, etc. I see technologiest as being a variety of things, heck I'm a technologist. I haven't written code for a very long time and there are tons of smart coders I've met over the years, but that doesn't make me less than those coders.

    Written code without a voice is gibberish and Scoble is clearly a voice for many types of technology. If all he talked about was Microsoft and in fact perhaps used MS products would make him the "Corporate shill" that is constantly claimed. I find it refreshing to hear his perspective about a variety of topics and in fact that brings a humanity to Microsoft too.

    I wonder...should I create a psuedo blog entry about how I hate Scoble and am dropping him just to create a web fury and increase my blog stats? Nah, I'll just keep reading him without judging and enjoy to variety of topics and technology he leads me to. Then I'll make my own decisions about it. Maybe that's what you should do Roy Schestowitz (or should I call you leecher for short?)
  • TDavid: great point. I'll try to work that more in in the future. Most of that is just laziness. The other small part is often I don't know who I'm going to be interviewing today.
  • Robert, about the rumors, and the effort needed to prove they arent real, is so true.

    THe Xbox.com forums are constantly filled with rumors, and even with official MS word, people STILL believe conspiracy theories and rumors.
  • Over the last 2-3 weeks there has been a surge of criticism against Scoble. Much of it seems to be more towards the Scoble as representative of the 'agressive' Microsoft Corporation, rather anything personal about the man himself.

    I also get the feeling that there is growing resentment over at Wordpress.com about Scoble benefitting from a personalised blog, advertising and an oddly constant first place position on the WP ranking system.
  • met
    I almost never watch the C9 interviews because of its length.
    Can't you get a DVD menu kind of thing inside your video (since you are using wmv anyway), so that people can see what's contained in the video and jump to the section they want. ?

    Or also clips or highlights ?
  • Zealots will be zealots. So what if I person unsubscribes because they think you are a Microsoft shill..

    Yes you are part of the marketing group (albiet indirectly) as you show off items that are being produced my your employer.. I wish I was in your shoes as it must be a very interesting experience. Especially your job where you get to go almost everywhere and you ask questions like a typical user. You tend to chuckle a bit too much but that is your personality, you're a chuckler (and not a cuckhold to microsoft)..

    Brush it off. Hey I was an OS/2 person at one time as at the time it was the best solution for me. Notice I said 'for me'. I didn't recommend it for everyone. Windows products are not for everyone, and for sure, linux distros are not for everyone.. The nice thing is that we have a choice (pretty much)

    People do not complain that a game has its graphics and sound files in a proprietary format now do they?

    If you want to see the graphics then you have to use t he platform/OS.. geez PS2 games are in a proprietary format.. Can't see them on my PS1 or my PC.. so guess what they're locked out to me.. I have to buy a ps2 to use/see them..

    I've used the EFS on windows xp to keep others from casually snooping into my data.. and I know from personal experience that there is no cypher that cannot be broken given enough time and effort.

    And companies that are encrypting data are trying to keep the data private (the more secure the better) since some of that data is my personal information and I don't want that information to be out in the wild. Identity theft is bad enough as is.
  • Goebbels
    I don't see a single invalidation of what he says or much of a rebuttal.

    As for his "rumor" his post does not claim there is a backdoor. It says the Brits are interested in getting one added; in fact, it's actually just one persons opinion that the gov't should pursue attempting to do so: "According to a recent article from the BBC, there was collaboration involving the British Government and Microsoft – collaboration over getting the back door to Windows Vista."

    You and other softies are so paranoid about, but dangerously in need of sucking on the teet of, your own company that you misread this as someone saying a backdoor exists? Show me where either the BBC story or his post says this?

    Again, more misrepresentation. From YOU.
  • Met: the problem is lack of resources. My time.

    Viewers themselves can select clips. Have you seen that feature?
  • Goebbels: don't take my word on the BBC article. Go read what CNET has to say: http://tech.memeorandum.com/060304/p28#a060304p28
  • Er, CNET article here: http://news.com.com/2100-1016_3-6046016.html -- the Memeorandum link has that and a link back to the team's blog here: http://blogs.msdn.com/si_team/archive/2006/03/0...
  • anon
    What do you think? Does this kind of tactic persuade you to switch operating systems?

    I think as a convicted monopolist the days of Microsoft employees "persuading" people to switch operating systems are long past. Instead of stealing market from alternative operating systems, Microsoft marketing's role in a responsible corporate system is to grow the market and increase demand for computing in general. Let's start by making Office and Windows more accessible to the general populace who does not use computers today.

    Further, with the growth of dynamic web sites and of web application environments, it is obvious to everyone in the engineering fields that Microsoft's offerings are less secure, less stable, scale poorly and are proprietary in nature in comparison with GPL or GNU-based offerings. This is true both on the client (Internet Explorer, ActiveX) and server side (.Net .aspx, Biztalk server, commerce server, Windows 2003 Server etc). A decision to use proprietary, Windows-only products is no longer a credible choice to people in the know and is an unwise, insecure, and overly expensive path within the enterprise.

    Microsoft's future would be better secured (and its shareholders better rewarded) if Microsoft focused on improving its low-end offerings for general computing tasks - where it can still do some good - instead of trying to prove itself in hard-core, network-centric computing environments where the damage to customers and competitors is greater.
  • james
    Yeah,
    editing those vids would be nice.
    An hour vid with a lot of filler is hard for me to justify watching.It reminds me of home videos- editing is your friend!
    It's really quick n easy to cut-have your default transition and boom -cut to the meat.
  • Goebbels
    "Goebbels: don’t take my word on the BBC article. Go read what CNET has to say"

    Why? I can READ, Scoble. I read the BBC article. In fact, I've read the CNET article. Rather, since you claim he alleged there IS a backdoor, please point to the simple statement which states such. Pretty please.
  • Goebbels: implied, not alleged.

    Anon: please go and look at the security stats for Windows Server 2003 and compare to the other operating systems out there. Your data is incorrect.

    James: editing is a lot harder than shooting. Mark Twain once said "I don't have time to send you a short letter." I'll update that to say "I don't have time to send you a short video." Sorry, but that's the way it is. I also disagree that there's a lot of filler in my videos. It's pretty obvious you haven't watched a lot of them if you say that.
  • NOTHING BUT PUNKS, CRYING ON THE INTERNET AGAIN. WHY IS THERE SO MUCH CRYING ON THIS ONE AND THAT ONE (BLOGS). I AM TRIED OF I HATE YOU AND I HATE YOU. BE A MAN DO SOMETHING BETTER WITH YOUR TIME, GO GET A LINUX MAKE SOME MONEY OF THEIR, BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT IT COMES DOWN TO. MEANING IF THE SHOE WAS ON THE OTHER FOOT WHO WOULD BE CRYING THEN, THE SAME OLD GEEKS, WEARING THE SOME OLD PANTS. AND GOOD FOR YOU SCOBLE, TELLING HIM HE COULD GO AND **** HISSELF IN SUCH A GOOD MANOR. ("Personally I’m glad that Roy is an advocate for non-Microsoft technologies. I’d hate it if he was using these kinds of tactics on our side of the fence.

    If I ever see a Microsoft advocate treat someone advocating another platform this way I’ll personally rail on them. That’s not a tactic that’s acceptable".)
  • james
    I havent watched all 500 no sir.

    Hey it was just a little critique on your videos.

    I thought you were a professional videographer ( as in getting paid to shoot) and post work is just s important as shooting.
  • No, the conversation is what's important. Not the video quality. I'm not trying to compete with MTV.
  • Guys,

    Let's cut to the short of all this: Robert isn't a techie. He's an user who understands tech, and in that there is gold.

    You see, Robert is an observer. He has the ability to step back and see if a piece of tech, or a business practice, really fits into the larger picture. Robert does this with honesty and humor most other tehnologists seem to lack. That is Robert's contribution to the "technification" process.

    No perspection obtainable by a human is ever completely objective. There are so many things in life that influence how we perceive things without our even being aware of the influence. One of Robert's traits that has earned my respect is the apparent willingness to question even his own viewpoint. We live in a world where perceived reality can change overnight. Anyone in a position like Robert's has to be willing to recalculate his perspective at a moment's notice.

    That having been said, yes, he does tend to "gush" over us techies. But then, so does Leo LaPorte. :)
  • james
    MTV?

    I tried to say that I don't have the time to watch 1 hour videos that could be shorter.
    Thats all, thats my take.I just dont have the time. Thats fine.
    I know that a lot of video pod casters do a bit minimal of editing for time

    MTV?
    Jeez.
    not what i was getting at at all.
  • Robert Scoble isn't Microsoft, nor is he the head of Microsoft PR or even what passes for development there. He is simply a blogger who works for Microsoft who has also co-authored a book on blogging.
    I find it inappropriate to attack Mr. Scoble if one has issues with Microsoft. For example I think that the entire SharePoint and Internet Explorer teams should be fired if not publicly burned at the stake, yet I don't hold Robert responsible for their criminal ineptitude.
    Bottom Line: Leave Robert alone unless he does anymore of those naked photo shoots with Shel Israel.
  • James: I understand. I don't do the videos for you. I do them for people who care about the topic enough to watch a one hour video. There are other places to learn about our technologies in far less time. And don't take that as an offense.

    Mike: thanks! But, when you're on top you're hated. The same way people hate the Yankees. It comes with the job.
  • Robert,

    A huge chunk of the problem is when you ask someone at MS working on a specific tech or talking about that tech, and you ask them about interoperability with similar implementations of the same idea, and it becomes ridiculously obvious that they not only don't know anything concrete, but they don't even know that there IS other tech. For example, my exchange at:

    http://channel9.msdn.com/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=1...

    I mean holy crap, I don't expect ernie to know all the details on Zeroconf, but he doesn't even know that it's been shipping in printers for the last two years? Or that it's more than just a printer tech?

    How in the hell am i supposed to take the Vista team seriously when this is the kind of interface I get? Do they even know what the heck is going on in the rest of the computing world, or are they so ignorant that they believe no one has been working on anything that they have as well?

    I mean, it would explain a lot, because there are days you'd swear that the Windows folks think they are the only people working on OS's in the world.

    It's a serious problem. If I have to explain the basics of IETF standards that I need Vista to be able to function with, then I'm not going to be able to take their answers seriously, because I know they literally don't know what they are talking about.

    That, by the way, does not make me want to recommend deploying Vista anytime before the first SR release, and yes, I actually DO have that kind of job.

    I need to know that Vista engineers are indeed not just aware they aren't the only OS designers on the planet, but that they are up to speed on what the rest of the world is doing, and that interoperating is NOT being defined ala 1995, i.e. "Just replace everything with Windows and it will all magically be better". Because if I'm not, I'll be pushing to hold of on Vista until Longhorn server is available and has a SR release out, so that we have time to make sure that Vista is capable of working with non-windows OS's properly.

    I'm not the only IT person that needs to know this, but I can tell you that MS has done a craptacular job with that message.

    MS needs us for Vista FAR more than we need Vista. We write the checks, and MS better start answering our questions a lot better if they want more of those.
  • Robert, I honestly don't see why you even respond to someone who hides behind the name Goebbels without a link. Does anyone here know who Goebbels was? How can any sane person use that name?
  • Geektalker
    It was a vicious, unprovoked personal attack, and I feel sorry for Robert, but let's face facts here. Robert Scoble is paid $100K per year plus bonuses to portray Microsoft in a positive light.

    Advocates trying to break free of the Microsoft stranglehold of the industry seem to need a (personal) target to attack. This one seems to have chosen Scoble as that target.

    But Scoble, as an evangelist for Microsoft, is paid to be a target. It's a bit like celebrities not liking their photo taken. For better or worse, it comes with the job.
  • anon
    Anon: please go and look at the security stats for Windows Server 2003 and compare to the other operating systems out there. Your data is incorrect.

    Great. Show me a your marketing data so that as an engineer I can refute it. Let's start with one thing: marketshare is not a signal of quality, so skip the sales data. Let's talk features, scabality and cost.

    BTW, are you ///really/// qualified to say whether there is a backdoor in Windows Vista or not?

    As I remember it, there was a backdoor in Frontpage that Microsoft management didn't even know about until years later.
  • Sorry Robert - small misunderstanding here - I think that your use of Wordpress is just fine. My dasBlog suggestions was actually a reply to Brian's question (http://scobleizer.wordpress.com/2006/03/04/bett...) as an alternative to DotNetNuke.
  • I think it's incredible that a few people here have written a 5 paragraph essay in reply here. I think I randomly viewed a channel 9 video in early September, and it was not too good of video quality. So to me, it seemed as though you, Robert, were some random Joe and snuck in, because the delvelopers didn't seem keen on talking. So I was like who is this guy trying to be?

    Then when I caught a few posts after that on here. I was like who is this guy, he needs to just shut up. Well a few days later I found out you really do work at Microsoft, and have various connections. So I think it is almost funny what Roy did. When I did a write-up about coComment, a few people had basically ripped me off and now they basically think as themselves as mini-Scoble's. But they don't really know what they are saying because they have a few errors per post, and it annoys me royally.
  • Anon: you totally misunderstand my role here. I'm +not+ qualified. But, I do know who is. And I've spent more than an hour with them. And they say that the idea that they'd -- on purpose -- put a back door into Windows Vista is just plain nuts. And, talking with other people who THINK about software development, that point of view is verified. But you'll soon be able to see an interview I did with the team so you'll be able to judge my role for yourself.
  • Geektalker. I make less than $100,000 a year in salary. Hope that helps.
  • Anon: that data is out on the Internet on sites that track security vulnerabilities. Why don't you learn how to use Google. Why should I teach you how to do that?
  • Robert, when I met you at Mindcamp, I said, "I didn't know there would be luminaries here!" And you said, "Where?"

    I think the whole concept of reputation in blogging is fundamentally flawed. Certainly this is a matter of your "stardom" and whether it's merited, a line of thinking that is also dubious. Like Charles Bukowski said of his writing critics: Why don't they read something else? Teenagers learn these politics on livejournal and myspace: After enough practice, you can stop reading someone's words... without even announcing it to the world! Without even ripping them down! Some adults apparently have a lengthier emotional process to work through. Let me help you out: What makes a person interesting is what they love. It's a big folksonomy, people. Big enough for you and me to forget each other exists. No rant needed. Microsoft is not in trouble when people rant and huff out. Microsoft's in trouble the day nobody cares what they say.
  • Geektalker: no where in my employee agreement with Microsoft does it say that I am paid to portray Microsoft in a positive light.

    I'm paid to help software developers build software for our platforms. That's a far different job. Channel 9 is my day job. My blog is mine and I often don't portray Microsoft in a positive light here. You do realize that my words are running on a Linux server, don't you? How does that portray Microsoft in a positive light?
  • John: exactly! Being on the A lister doesn't matter one whit. We couldn't keep TechCrunch from jumping to the top and he only started seven months ago.
  • met
    We ?
  • Ok, just because you support Microsoft doesn't make you evil, nor does it make you a techie. I haven't read enough of your postings to tell just what you are, nor do I care all that much, because if we ever meet, that's when I will most likely find out.

    That said, given what I have read, this guy's a joke. His site design sucks, mainly due to how much graphics he has and how tough the text is to read. Worse, the flashy graphics look like they were done by a third grader that snorted mommy's coke while smoking daddies pot at the same time - a big mess. You may not have flashier graphics, but at least I can read your blog, and you aren't wasting my time by sputtering stupid.

    You may have wasted your own time defending yourself to an idiot like this, but mainly because this loser didn't deserve the response.
  • Goebbels
    "Goebbels: implied, not alleged."

    I can't help it if you can't rad. The BBCarticle clearly talks aboutwho thinks the Brit gov't should talk to Microsoft about adding a backdoor. You said he said there IS a backdoor. I don't care about your failure to comprehend. Don't suggest that I can't read or understandwhat was implied or alleged when you clearly state something which is UNTRUE.
  • The name Goebbels is a synonym for Untrue.. that is if you know history. And if you do, it's a tasteless choice of a handle.
  • Ahh, I can see Goebbels where you're coming from. But, you're being pedantic. Any one of my readers can click on that link and see what he actually said. It's pretty clear there was at least the implication that there'd be a back door in Vista. But, you're right on the face of it. Sorry.
  • met: exactly my point. Lots of people assume that the Alisters are working together to keep the Z list down. I saw lots of people call us "gatekeepers." Doc Searls pointed at tons of that kind of comments a few weeks back. I think that's pretty funny. If you're good you'll go to the top of the list within a few weeks. Did anyone know who Foldera was 16 days ago? No.
  • Don
    "68. Geektalker. I make less than $100,000 a year in salary. Hope that helps."

    Either you mean salary like Bill Clinton meant he didn't have sex, or you need me to help you renegotiate. Your package has got to be way way better than that or you aren't getting what you are worth. Give me a call and we can negotiate something reasonable for you. Don't you work for the richest man in the world? He must appreciate your value.
  • Don, I'm very serious about my salary. And, I am flattered by people who say I'm not getting what I'm worth! I find that most companies don't want to increase your pay until you call them on it. The problem is, to call them on it you need to have something else in the bag. I also find that the more I chase dollars, the less happy I am. I'm living a fun life cause I chase fun experiences. That's how I get paid back.

    Oh, and the world's richest man didn't get there by paying more than he has to. :-)
  • anon
    Anon: you totally misunderstand my role here. I’m +not+ qualified. But, I do know who is. And I’ve spent more than an hour with them. And they say that the idea that they’d — on purpose — put a back door into Windows Vista is just plain nuts. And, talking with other people who THINK about software development, that point of view is verified. But you’ll soon be able to see an interview I did with the team so you’ll be able to judge my role for yourself.

    OK, but you do realize that prior versions of Windows had backdoors even though Microsoft denied it?

    Anon: that data is out on the Internet on sites that track security vulnerabilities.

    Oh come on, Scoble. Thousands of Microsoft bloggers shilling for Microsoft every waking hour of the day. Heck, //dead people// wrote in support of Microsoft after the antitrust trial. Microsoft employees rigged a .net poll on zdnet. I mean, look at your posts - you're snide to every larger tech company out there either by directly criticizing them or saying your son or wife don't like them.

    BTW, how many 747s do Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer have. Can you ask them?

    Oh, and please don't take the tone of my message as a sign of disrespect to you personally. I have tremendous admiration for what you're doing in general, I just don't like who you're doing it for.
  • Hey Robert!

    Keep doing what your doing. Who cares about the A-list, who cares about the good the bad and the ugly. Its a big world out there, there is space for everyone.

    Do you know what the best bit about the internet is, there's an off button. Everyone has a right to associate themselves with whomever they wish. And in fact they can say whatever they want, and they can even get nasty sometimes. Whatever, just switch it off.

    The world is better with you in it so keep going.

    Note: I don't agree with every single thing you have ever said, but that is the beauty of the blogosphere. If I wanted, I could call you on it and get locked in healthy debate, or I could forget about it. However I think getting all mudslingy and nasty is counter-productive and that is the real ugly.

    Why can't we just get along?
  • Anon: glad you admit you aren't being intellectually honest and are just out to destroy Microsoft, no matter the means you need to use to do just that. Tomorrow morning when you wake up, can you look yourself in the mirror and say you are any better morally than what you are trying to destroy?

    There ARE objective security sites out there, by the way, that track vulnerabilities. For you to assume we have bought them all off is just totally intellectually dishonest. But, glad you admitted that to the world. At least we are getting someplace here.
  • I will second all the voices saying you're way underpaid.
  • I am curious what these guys really mean by backdoors. Backdoors in what sense?
  • gbrewer
    What I have always found interesting about the fanatical anti-Microsoft crowd is that they hurt there own cause way more than Microsoft’s by the way they express themselves. How many businesses that were considering using Linux have been turned off by the tactics Linux zealots use to attack Microsoft? I will bet far more than were convinced by such inane rhetoric.
  • Go Robert Go! I think just the fact that you put yourself out here every day, for the world to comment on, try to implode, critique, and basically tear down is amazing. I am by no means as technically adept as many of the people who read this blog, but I come here to learn new stuff, to see interesting conversation, and to see what Microsoft is doing before they do it. And I get that.

    As for anyone who is trying to rip anyone else down in hopes of bringing yourself up, I say there is plenty of pie for all of you to enjoy. Microsoft has it's place, Apple has it's place, and so does Linux. There's room for all of us to play nice in this big sandbox of the world. We can go a lot further if we work together to try to take things to the next level than if we try to rip each other apart.
  • Did you mean this quote?

    "I have made this letter longer than usual, only because I have not had the time to make it shorter. " - Blaise Pascal
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