Patrick not welcome at LinuxWorld

Ahh, when the Open Source folks wonder why using Linux isn’t “cool” you have no further to look than this sign for the reason — any conference where I can’t take my son and walk around is just something that’s going to have a hard time impressing me (hint: we both went to MacWorld with Dave Winer and then walked across the street and bought a Mac):

Thanks to Scott Beale for the photo.

Another data point? I haven’t been in Second Life since they told me my son isn’t welcome. Why not? Cause our time together is limited and might as well do things that let us play and learn together.

A big reason I am buying a Mac is so I can use iSight and iChat with Patrick (it’s a lot better quality if you have Macs on both sides of the conversation).

If you want me to use your technology you better figure out how to get Patrick first.

Anyway, everyone knows that 12-year-olds are a lot cooler and more up-to-date on technology than fat, white, 41-year-olds.

Aside: it’s nice as a manager to get photographic proof that your employees are working instead of playing Pacman or sitting on the beach. Damn, Irina and Eddie are getting some cool interviews lately! (That’s Craig Newmark, founder of Craig’s List, sitting behind Irina, and she’s interviewing Cmdr Taco, founder of Slashdot). Nice new Sony camera, huh?!? :-)

Comments

  1. “Anyway, everyone knows that 12-year-olds are a lot cooler and more up-to-date on technology than fat, white, 41-year-olds”

    Lol :) Children have a larger learning capacity to grasp things. Too bad about that linuxworld. I am still not convinced about the hype that Ubuntu seems to be generating. Linux still seems to be made out for geeks :( .

  2. “Anyway, everyone knows that 12-year-olds are a lot cooler and more up-to-date on technology than fat, white, 41-year-olds”

    Lol :) Children have a larger learning capacity to grasp things. Too bad about that linuxworld. I am still not convinced about the hype that Ubuntu seems to be generating. Linux still seems to be made out for geeks :( .

  3. Cooler, but nothing but trouble. From a business perspective, having minors use your website that enables free expression is just not worth the trouble. Completely with you on the conference though, that is just ‘tarded.

  4. Cooler, but nothing but trouble. From a business perspective, having minors use your website that enables free expression is just not worth the trouble. Completely with you on the conference though, that is just ‘tarded.

  5. Cooler, but nothing but trouble. From a business perspective, having minors use your website that enables free expression is just not worth the trouble. Completely with you on the conference though, that is just ‘tarded.

  6. Linux is a case study in why open source is all about the journey, and not getting there. After all these years, linux is still only useful for web servers, some other specialized uses, and ubergeeks who can’t communicate with humans. It’s not ready for prime time and it does not pass the grandma/grandpa test. Ubuntu may be a big step in the right direction, but I would far rather see my parents using macs right now than linux. No contest.

  7. Linux is a case study in why open source is all about the journey, and not getting there. After all these years, linux is still only useful for web servers, some other specialized uses, and ubergeeks who can’t communicate with humans. It’s not ready for prime time and it does not pass the grandma/grandpa test. Ubuntu may be a big step in the right direction, but I would far rather see my parents using macs right now than linux. No contest.

  8. There may be insurance and contractual issues that they have to take into consideration…..

    They are NOT unaware of the precociousness of many Teenaged students, but there may be licensing regulations or other matters that may factor in to their decisions.

  9. There may be insurance and contractual issues that they have to take into consideration…..

    They are NOT unaware of the precociousness of many Teenaged students, but there may be licensing regulations or other matters that may factor in to their decisions.

  10. searchengines: That may be the case, so if it’s financial, then sure I understand. But if it’s another reason then it’s not a positive result. Should do what they can to get the younger crowd in there.

  11. searchengines: That may be the case, so if it’s financial, then sure I understand. But if it’s another reason then it’s not a positive result. Should do what they can to get the younger crowd in there.

  12. searchengines: That may be the case, so if it’s financial, then sure I understand. But if it’s another reason then it’s not a positive result. Should do what they can to get the younger crowd in there.

  13. You know what they say about the drinking age of 21? “Old enough to die for your country, but not old enough to drink beer.”

    In this case it’s “Old enough to contribute to the Linux kernel, but not old enough to attend LinuxWorld.” ;-)

    Funny how the LinuxWorld logo on that sign incorporates a penguin with outstretched arms. Only he’s not welcoming you for a hug, he’s BARRING you from entering. :-)

    Gee, I guess it is a small World after all…

  14. You know what they say about the drinking age of 21? “Old enough to die for your country, but not old enough to drink beer.”

    In this case it’s “Old enough to contribute to the Linux kernel, but not old enough to attend LinuxWorld.” ;-)

    Funny how the LinuxWorld logo on that sign incorporates a penguin with outstretched arms. Only he’s not welcoming you for a hug, he’s BARRING you from entering. :-)

    Gee, I guess it is a small World after all…

  15. You know what they say about the drinking age of 21? “Old enough to die for your country, but not old enough to drink beer.”

    In this case it’s “Old enough to contribute to the Linux kernel, but not old enough to attend LinuxWorld.” ;-)

    Funny how the LinuxWorld logo on that sign incorporates a penguin with outstretched arms. Only he’s not welcoming you for a hug, he’s BARRING you from entering. :-)

    Gee, I guess it is a small World after all…

  16. You may want to consider that LinuxWorld is a product of IDG WORLD EXPO CORP. and may not represent the attitude of entire Linux community on this topic.

  17. You may want to consider that LinuxWorld is a product of IDG WORLD EXPO CORP. and may not represent the attitude of entire Linux community on this topic.

  18. You may want to consider that LinuxWorld is a product of IDG WORLD EXPO CORP. and may not represent the attitude of entire Linux community on this topic.

  19. “I haven’t been in Second Life since they told me my son isn’t welcome. Why not? Cause our time together is limited and might as well do things that let us play and learn together.”

    Weren’t you banned?

    Also, didn’t you have about 6 posts talking about how it was so cool and everyone would be doing things inside it? Two months later you realize that reality is better.

    Thanks, some of us knew that already.

  20. “I haven’t been in Second Life since they told me my son isn’t welcome. Why not? Cause our time together is limited and might as well do things that let us play and learn together.”

    Weren’t you banned?

    Also, didn’t you have about 6 posts talking about how it was so cool and everyone would be doing things inside it? Two months later you realize that reality is better.

    Thanks, some of us knew that already.

  21. “I haven’t been in Second Life since they told me my son isn’t welcome. Why not? Cause our time together is limited and might as well do things that let us play and learn together.”

    Weren’t you banned?

    Also, didn’t you have about 6 posts talking about how it was so cool and everyone would be doing things inside it? Two months later you realize that reality is better.

    Thanks, some of us knew that already.

  22. “any conference where I can’t take my son and walk around is just something that’s going to have a hard time impressing me”

    I tried to buy my 14 year old son a ticket to the PDC, but 21 was the age limit there. I understand not allowing minors to the events with open alcohol, but being able to attend the technical stuff would have been nice. The official reason was that it was a Convention center policy for insurance reasons.

  23. “any conference where I can’t take my son and walk around is just something that’s going to have a hard time impressing me”

    I tried to buy my 14 year old son a ticket to the PDC, but 21 was the age limit there. I understand not allowing minors to the events with open alcohol, but being able to attend the technical stuff would have been nice. The official reason was that it was a Convention center policy for insurance reasons.

  24. “any conference where I can’t take my son and walk around is just something that’s going to have a hard time impressing me”

    I tried to buy my 14 year old son a ticket to the PDC, but 21 was the age limit there. I understand not allowing minors to the events with open alcohol, but being able to attend the technical stuff would have been nice. The official reason was that it was a Convention center policy for insurance reasons.

  25. The general point of welcoming the professional’s family being an important part of welcoming the professional is a good one.

    In the business my Dad is in, they have this one big, big conference every year where most of the vendors exhibit their new lines. It isn’t attended by a ton of kids, but there are some and there are more than when I started going, which I think was like when I was 5ish or something. I’ve gone nearly every year since then, now being 21.

    When your Dad, i.e. the person making the purchasing decisions for the company, is standing next to you – everyone is nice. But, then when I got old enough to walk around on my own a bit, I’d notice people giving me looks or treating me in a less than gracious manner. Even straight out rude at times. (Obviously not limited to conferences – people like this treat kids like this at brick and mortars, over the phone, ete. etc.). What I am getting at is this: what would I do when that happened? I’d report right back to my Mom and Dad and it would affect how all of us looked at the company or the person, which in turn, affected buying decisions. So, it’s important to realize that family is important.

    I realize, of course, that there are venues where it is appropriate for only the professional to go. Certainly. But, generally, I don’t feel that expos (where you walk around and look at products) should be that way.

  26. The general point of welcoming the professional’s family being an important part of welcoming the professional is a good one.

    In the business my Dad is in, they have this one big, big conference every year where most of the vendors exhibit their new lines. It isn’t attended by a ton of kids, but there are some and there are more than when I started going, which I think was like when I was 5ish or something. I’ve gone nearly every year since then, now being 21.

    When your Dad, i.e. the person making the purchasing decisions for the company, is standing next to you – everyone is nice. But, then when I got old enough to walk around on my own a bit, I’d notice people giving me looks or treating me in a less than gracious manner. Even straight out rude at times. (Obviously not limited to conferences – people like this treat kids like this at brick and mortars, over the phone, ete. etc.). What I am getting at is this: what would I do when that happened? I’d report right back to my Mom and Dad and it would affect how all of us looked at the company or the person, which in turn, affected buying decisions. So, it’s important to realize that family is important.

    I realize, of course, that there are venues where it is appropriate for only the professional to go. Certainly. But, generally, I don’t feel that expos (where you walk around and look at products) should be that way.

  27. The general point of welcoming the professional’s family being an important part of welcoming the professional is a good one.

    In the business my Dad is in, they have this one big, big conference every year where most of the vendors exhibit their new lines. It isn’t attended by a ton of kids, but there are some and there are more than when I started going, which I think was like when I was 5ish or something. I’ve gone nearly every year since then, now being 21.

    When your Dad, i.e. the person making the purchasing decisions for the company, is standing next to you – everyone is nice. But, then when I got old enough to walk around on my own a bit, I’d notice people giving me looks or treating me in a less than gracious manner. Even straight out rude at times. (Obviously not limited to conferences – people like this treat kids like this at brick and mortars, over the phone, ete. etc.). What I am getting at is this: what would I do when that happened? I’d report right back to my Mom and Dad and it would affect how all of us looked at the company or the person, which in turn, affected buying decisions. So, it’s important to realize that family is important.

    I realize, of course, that there are venues where it is appropriate for only the professional to go. Certainly. But, generally, I don’t feel that expos (where you walk around and look at products) should be that way.

  28. i think it’s fantastic that you make it a point to ‘bring your kid to work’ as much as you do. It’s tough defining the lines between work and family and you seem to have accepted that it’s difficult and found ways to manage it better. good on ya.

  29. i think it’s fantastic that you make it a point to ‘bring your kid to work’ as much as you do. It’s tough defining the lines between work and family and you seem to have accepted that it’s difficult and found ways to manage it better. good on ya.

  30. i think it’s fantastic that you make it a point to ‘bring your kid to work’ as much as you do. It’s tough defining the lines between work and family and you seem to have accepted that it’s difficult and found ways to manage it better. good on ya.

  31. On the other hand, where do you have the cutoff? Do you allow babies in a conference? Little kids around that kind of equipment is dangerous. I guarantee you that if I don’t realize there’s a stroller with a baby, or a very small child behind me, and I drop my backpack on them, that’s a dead kid. That thing weighs anywhere from 20 to 40 pounds depending on what i’m doing that day. From my shoulder to the ground is around 4 feet. Do the math.

    As well, kids have this really annoying tendency to behave like kids. Which is not cool when you’re talking about a couple grand in equipment or more. I’m real sorry that Patrick gets tarred with that brush, but most teenagers act like idiots in such a situation, and the less I see of them, the better I like it. Patrick, like everyone else, has to deal with what his peer group does for and to him. Welcome to hell, here’s your accordion. There are a lot of good kids, but they have to prove that. The “fairness” of this is immaterial, that’s just the way it is. (note, just to head this off early, I have a 13 year old son. he’d love to come to Macworld. And when I feel he’s old enough to function on his own in that environment, during the times when I’m doing things that he can’t be a part of, he will. Until then he doesn’t. So yeah, I DO understand the parent POV)

    Finally…the idea that everything needs to be kid or even minor friendly is stupid. When I go to a bar, I don’t want to see a baby there. I don’t want little kids running around. In fact, there are places people go specifically so that they do not have to deal with kids.

    At some point, the idea that kids *must* be welcome everywhere, or that there’s something wrong with a place or a person that doesn’t want kids around needs to be purged, and ruthlessly. Yes, it sucks to have to wait. But that’s life. You have to deal with these things. Deciding that someone doesn’t want your business because they aren’t particularly interested in talking to a kid they don’t know is a tad judgemental, and smacks of cutting of a nose to spite a face.

  32. On the other hand, where do you have the cutoff? Do you allow babies in a conference? Little kids around that kind of equipment is dangerous. I guarantee you that if I don’t realize there’s a stroller with a baby, or a very small child behind me, and I drop my backpack on them, that’s a dead kid. That thing weighs anywhere from 20 to 40 pounds depending on what i’m doing that day. From my shoulder to the ground is around 4 feet. Do the math.

    As well, kids have this really annoying tendency to behave like kids. Which is not cool when you’re talking about a couple grand in equipment or more. I’m real sorry that Patrick gets tarred with that brush, but most teenagers act like idiots in such a situation, and the less I see of them, the better I like it. Patrick, like everyone else, has to deal with what his peer group does for and to him. Welcome to hell, here’s your accordion. There are a lot of good kids, but they have to prove that. The “fairness” of this is immaterial, that’s just the way it is. (note, just to head this off early, I have a 13 year old son. he’d love to come to Macworld. And when I feel he’s old enough to function on his own in that environment, during the times when I’m doing things that he can’t be a part of, he will. Until then he doesn’t. So yeah, I DO understand the parent POV)

    Finally…the idea that everything needs to be kid or even minor friendly is stupid. When I go to a bar, I don’t want to see a baby there. I don’t want little kids running around. In fact, there are places people go specifically so that they do not have to deal with kids.

    At some point, the idea that kids *must* be welcome everywhere, or that there’s something wrong with a place or a person that doesn’t want kids around needs to be purged, and ruthlessly. Yes, it sucks to have to wait. But that’s life. You have to deal with these things. Deciding that someone doesn’t want your business because they aren’t particularly interested in talking to a kid they don’t know is a tad judgemental, and smacks of cutting of a nose to spite a face.

  33. On the other hand, where do you have the cutoff? Do you allow babies in a conference? Little kids around that kind of equipment is dangerous. I guarantee you that if I don’t realize there’s a stroller with a baby, or a very small child behind me, and I drop my backpack on them, that’s a dead kid. That thing weighs anywhere from 20 to 40 pounds depending on what i’m doing that day. From my shoulder to the ground is around 4 feet. Do the math.

    As well, kids have this really annoying tendency to behave like kids. Which is not cool when you’re talking about a couple grand in equipment or more. I’m real sorry that Patrick gets tarred with that brush, but most teenagers act like idiots in such a situation, and the less I see of them, the better I like it. Patrick, like everyone else, has to deal with what his peer group does for and to him. Welcome to hell, here’s your accordion. There are a lot of good kids, but they have to prove that. The “fairness” of this is immaterial, that’s just the way it is. (note, just to head this off early, I have a 13 year old son. he’d love to come to Macworld. And when I feel he’s old enough to function on his own in that environment, during the times when I’m doing things that he can’t be a part of, he will. Until then he doesn’t. So yeah, I DO understand the parent POV)

    Finally…the idea that everything needs to be kid or even minor friendly is stupid. When I go to a bar, I don’t want to see a baby there. I don’t want little kids running around. In fact, there are places people go specifically so that they do not have to deal with kids.

    At some point, the idea that kids *must* be welcome everywhere, or that there’s something wrong with a place or a person that doesn’t want kids around needs to be purged, and ruthlessly. Yes, it sucks to have to wait. But that’s life. You have to deal with these things. Deciding that someone doesn’t want your business because they aren’t particularly interested in talking to a kid they don’t know is a tad judgemental, and smacks of cutting of a nose to spite a face.

  34. Scoble, how hard did you work when you were at MS to lower the age limit at their conferneces? Or was it not an issue when they were signing your paycheck?

  35. Scoble, how hard did you work when you were at MS to lower the age limit at their conferneces? Or was it not an issue when they were signing your paycheck?

  36. We have another presidential candidate: John Welch. Great repsonse, John. Nothing like a rational perspective.

  37. We have another presidential candidate: John Welch. Great repsonse, John. Nothing like a rational perspective.

  38. Shawn Fanning was about 19 when he came out with Napster. Probably was working on it when he was 18. This is the new world of business; you have kids 16-18 working on real products. When do you become a “business professional”? If you want Linux/Unix that is ready for primetime and your grandparents, get a Mac.

  39. Shawn Fanning was about 19 when he came out with Napster. Probably was working on it when he was 18. This is the new world of business; you have kids 16-18 working on real products. When do you become a “business professional”? If you want Linux/Unix that is ready for primetime and your grandparents, get a Mac.

  40. @20. “when do you become a business professional?” when you have money do spend? Sure, there are plenty of examples of smart kids doing cool things. I mean, I saw “Baby Geniuses” so I know. ;-). But, that doesn’t mean you open these types of events up to everyone. As others have said, there may be liability issues at play here. Who knows? But since Linux is “free” what are they missing out on? Aren’t there plenty of people out there to help these put upon kids get started?

  41. @20. “when do you become a business professional?” when you have money do spend? Sure, there are plenty of examples of smart kids doing cool things. I mean, I saw “Baby Geniuses” so I know. ;-). But, that doesn’t mean you open these types of events up to everyone. As others have said, there may be liability issues at play here. Who knows? But since Linux is “free” what are they missing out on? Aren’t there plenty of people out there to help these put upon kids get started?

  42. On the other hand, where do you have the cutoff? Do you allow babies in a conference?

    Linux, Macintosh, Windows — these things are religions. :-) It helps if you get people early, in their formative years. Apple has always understood that — why do you think they’ve always targeted the Education market? Why do terrorist groups fund madrasas? Why does McDonald’s sell Happy Meals? GET THEM WHEN THEY’RE YOUNG.

    Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.

    But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

    — Matthew 6:13-14

    I don’t know about babies, but the teenage years are PRIME geek years. Years when you can eat, sleep and breathe computers. If you’re going to exclude people, you should exclude the old farts who are set in their ways. Don’t preach to the choir.

    I guarantee you that if I don’t realize there’s a stroller with a baby, or a very small child behind me, and I drop my backpack on them, that’s a dead kid. That thing weighs anywhere from 20 to 40 pounds depending on what i’m doing that day. From my shoulder to the ground is around 4 feet. Do the math.

    Ok, so you’re in a crowded Starbucks, or on a bus, or in a line at McDonalds, and some mom comes up behind you pushing a stroller, and you scream, “Agghhhh!!! Get that kid away from me!!! Don’t you realize I’ve got a 40-pound laptop here???”

    [cue dramatic news show theme]

    NEWS ANCHOR: “Tonight on NewsCenter 4: Innocent children are being crushed by heavy backpacks dropped by careless adults.”

    TEARFUL MOTHER: “The backpack just slipped off that man’s shoulder and flattened my little boy like a pancake… the doctor said he might have survived if it hadn’t been a ThinkPad…”

    NEWS ANCHOR: “Is your child safe? A special investigative report, tonight at 11.”

  43. On the other hand, where do you have the cutoff? Do you allow babies in a conference?

    Linux, Macintosh, Windows — these things are religions. :-) It helps if you get people early, in their formative years. Apple has always understood that — why do you think they’ve always targeted the Education market? Why do terrorist groups fund madrasas? Why does McDonald’s sell Happy Meals? GET THEM WHEN THEY’RE YOUNG.

    Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.

    But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

    — Matthew 6:13-14

    I don’t know about babies, but the teenage years are PRIME geek years. Years when you can eat, sleep and breathe computers. If you’re going to exclude people, you should exclude the old farts who are set in their ways. Don’t preach to the choir.

    I guarantee you that if I don’t realize there’s a stroller with a baby, or a very small child behind me, and I drop my backpack on them, that’s a dead kid. That thing weighs anywhere from 20 to 40 pounds depending on what i’m doing that day. From my shoulder to the ground is around 4 feet. Do the math.

    Ok, so you’re in a crowded Starbucks, or on a bus, or in a line at McDonalds, and some mom comes up behind you pushing a stroller, and you scream, “Agghhhh!!! Get that kid away from me!!! Don’t you realize I’ve got a 40-pound laptop here???”

    [cue dramatic news show theme]

    NEWS ANCHOR: “Tonight on NewsCenter 4: Innocent children are being crushed by heavy backpacks dropped by careless adults.”

    TEARFUL MOTHER: “The backpack just slipped off that man’s shoulder and flattened my little boy like a pancake… the doctor said he might have survived if it hadn’t been a ThinkPad…”

    NEWS ANCHOR: “Is your child safe? A special investigative report, tonight at 11.”

  44. Does anyone even know the reason why?

    I just finished reading the entertaining, Hunter S. Thompsonesque ValleyWag coverage of LinuxWorld (here and here.)

    A quote:

    Of all the exhibits on the show floor, none is as polarizing as Dice.com. This booth, clad in aging hotties and a tap of Bud Light, has been torturing attendees by demanding they search for better employment, right in front of their bosses. Plus, the poor bastard stuck in the big fuzzy dice costume is making an ass of him or her self just outside the entryway to the floor. But, hey, free beer!

    Soooo… it would seem that the age requirement is due to the presence of booth babes and beer (as in free).

    I guess ogling “aging hotties” while knocking back plastic cups of Bud Light (yum!) is a pleasure that should be reserved for, ahem, “business professionals.” :-)

    The good thing about the beer (as in free) is that it makes the hotties look younger and younger, and it makes Linux fonts look more and more antialiased. LOL

  45. Does anyone even know the reason why?

    I just finished reading the entertaining, Hunter S. Thompsonesque ValleyWag coverage of LinuxWorld (here and here.)

    A quote:

    Of all the exhibits on the show floor, none is as polarizing as Dice.com. This booth, clad in aging hotties and a tap of Bud Light, has been torturing attendees by demanding they search for better employment, right in front of their bosses. Plus, the poor bastard stuck in the big fuzzy dice costume is making an ass of him or her self just outside the entryway to the floor. But, hey, free beer!

    Soooo… it would seem that the age requirement is due to the presence of booth babes and beer (as in free).

    I guess ogling “aging hotties” while knocking back plastic cups of Bud Light (yum!) is a pleasure that should be reserved for, ahem, “business professionals.” :-)

    The good thing about the beer (as in free) is that it makes the hotties look younger and younger, and it makes Linux fonts look more and more antialiased. LOL

  46. Right on. Many teens take their computing a LOT more seriously than marketing suit people, and since they teens can’t drink at the conference they’d get more work done. SES San Jose also banned “under 18s”. These decisions reflect the fact that conferences are more about making money than about teaching and informing. Kudos to MashupCamp.com where young people were *welcomed* (though few were there).

  47. Right on. Many teens take their computing a LOT more seriously than marketing suit people, and since they teens can’t drink at the conference they’d get more work done. SES San Jose also banned “under 18s”. These decisions reflect the fact that conferences are more about making money than about teaching and informing. Kudos to MashupCamp.com where young people were *welcomed* (though few were there).

  48. If you are looking for quality on the video conferencing side of things with your son, check out SightSpeed. I use it often and it blows away anything else that I’ve ever seen. One of the nicest features is that you can do one-on-one conferencing for free. If you want to have up to four participants it will cost you $50 a year.

    I use it when I travel to chat with my favorite niece and nephew and you can get 30fps video going through this thing.

    Check out their website at: http://www.sightspeed.com

    I’m a very satisified user.

  49. If you are looking for quality on the video conferencing side of things with your son, check out SightSpeed. I use it often and it blows away anything else that I’ve ever seen. One of the nicest features is that you can do one-on-one conferencing for free. If you want to have up to four participants it will cost you $50 a year.

    I use it when I travel to chat with my favorite niece and nephew and you can get 30fps video going through this thing.

    Check out their website at: http://www.sightspeed.com

    I’m a very satisified user.

  50. My 13-year-old son has been playing Second Life for nearly a year… Within the last couple of months they officially waved the white flag and announced they would be combining the teen server and adult servers because they had so many masquerading children. (My son has had quite a lot to say about how to behave so as not to be unmasked as a child. I consider this valuable education in etiquette. ;-)

    signed, enabling mother

  51. My 13-year-old son has been playing Second Life for nearly a year… Within the last couple of months they officially waved the white flag and announced they would be combining the teen server and adult servers because they had so many masquerading children. (My son has had quite a lot to say about how to behave so as not to be unmasked as a child. I consider this valuable education in etiquette. ;-)

    signed, enabling mother

  52. Nice new Sony camera, huh?!?

    Oh it’s a dream, minus the crappy 24P, as their Cineframe emu pales in comparison to the DVX100A or the AG-HVX200 24P. But otherwise, great.

  53. Nice new Sony camera, huh?!?

    Oh it’s a dream, minus the crappy 24P, as their Cineframe emu pales in comparison to the DVX100A or the AG-HVX200 24P. But otherwise, great.

  54. Karim,

    I don’t stand in line at a McDonalds for an hour without sitting, then go to another part of the restaurant and stand THERE for an hour without sitting, and so forth for 12 hours.

    I do however, do that very thing during a Macworld. When I drop that backpack off my shoulders, I’m not looking DOWN to see if anyone’s there, I’m looking ACROSS, because i don’t expect babies. That’s one reason why i’m glad for the “no stroller” rule at macworld. That and too many people are entitlement queens and have those SUV strollers that take up an entire aisle and then some.

    I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.

  55. Karim,

    I don’t stand in line at a McDonalds for an hour without sitting, then go to another part of the restaurant and stand THERE for an hour without sitting, and so forth for 12 hours.

    I do however, do that very thing during a Macworld. When I drop that backpack off my shoulders, I’m not looking DOWN to see if anyone’s there, I’m looking ACROSS, because i don’t expect babies. That’s one reason why i’m glad for the “no stroller” rule at macworld. That and too many people are entitlement queens and have those SUV strollers that take up an entire aisle and then some.

    I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.

  56. Karim,

    I don’t stand in line at a McDonalds for an hour without sitting, then go to another part of the restaurant and stand THERE for an hour without sitting, and so forth for 12 hours.

    I do however, do that very thing during a Macworld. When I drop that backpack off my shoulders, I’m not looking DOWN to see if anyone’s there, I’m looking ACROSS, because i don’t expect babies. That’s one reason why i’m glad for the “no stroller” rule at macworld. That and too many people are entitlement queens and have those SUV strollers that take up an entire aisle and then some.

    I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.

  57. I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.

    There’s a bit in the novel The Virgin Suicides where a doctor addresses a girl who has tried to commit suicide. He tells her she isn’t old enough to know how bad life gets, and in reply, she says, “Obviously, Doctor, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old girl.”

    When you said you fail to see the need for anyone under 16-18 at a computer expo, my thought was, Obviously, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old boy in love with computers.

  58. I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.

    There’s a bit in the novel The Virgin Suicides where a doctor addresses a girl who has tried to commit suicide. He tells her she isn’t old enough to know how bad life gets, and in reply, she says, “Obviously, Doctor, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old girl.”

    When you said you fail to see the need for anyone under 16-18 at a computer expo, my thought was, Obviously, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old boy in love with computers.

  59. John Welch, you are a bonehead. You want teenagers to prove themselves, but you want them banned from everything. Uh… how are they going to prove themselves again?

    You also tar all teenagers with the same feather (sorry, was hankering for a new mismatched metaphor, thanks) but don’t see the point that MOST people would only bring kids if they were interested in computers to begin with. At least I certainly hope so.

    Curmudgeons like you shouldn’t have kids, I certainly hope you never do. You are too busy being focused on yourself, and people like that should not reproduce.

  60. John Welch, you are a bonehead. You want teenagers to prove themselves, but you want them banned from everything. Uh… how are they going to prove themselves again?

    You also tar all teenagers with the same feather (sorry, was hankering for a new mismatched metaphor, thanks) but don’t see the point that MOST people would only bring kids if they were interested in computers to begin with. At least I certainly hope so.

    Curmudgeons like you shouldn’t have kids, I certainly hope you never do. You are too busy being focused on yourself, and people like that should not reproduce.

  61. Oh, yeah, one more thing John – if you can’t take off your backpack without dropping it on the floor behind you constantly, YOU are the idiot, not anyone smaller than you. What if a little person goes to this event? Would you like to ban them too? Are you really so clumsy you can’t take off a backpack without crushing them and do you really think this should become everyone else’s problem instead of yours?

    Admit it, you are the babe-oogling, beer drinking type who doesn’t want kids to mess up your conference.

    Re the above, why can’t these supposed professionals wait until they have LEFT the conference for the evening before they start drinking and cheating on their wives? Why do we have to encourage the lack of discipline of a few idiots in nice suits?

    Morons.

  62. Oh, yeah, one more thing John – if you can’t take off your backpack without dropping it on the floor behind you constantly, YOU are the idiot, not anyone smaller than you. What if a little person goes to this event? Would you like to ban them too? Are you really so clumsy you can’t take off a backpack without crushing them and do you really think this should become everyone else’s problem instead of yours?

    Admit it, you are the babe-oogling, beer drinking type who doesn’t want kids to mess up your conference.

    Re the above, why can’t these supposed professionals wait until they have LEFT the conference for the evening before they start drinking and cheating on their wives? Why do we have to encourage the lack of discipline of a few idiots in nice suits?

    Morons.

  63. Actually, I have a 13 year old, and he’s not going to Macworld until I deem him able to handle himself by himself in a mature manner. If that means 18, so be it.

    And considering that I was ten when the Apple II was released, yes, I was at 13, quite in love with computers.

    I was also rather aware that there were places that I, as a 13 year old weren’t welcome due solely to my age. I didn’t like it, but it was an important lesson, namely, that the sun didn’t revolve around me. Just because I wanted something was not in fact, reason enough for me to get it.

    Maybe if there weren’t so many parents allowing their kids to be destructive idiots, and then refusing to take responsibility, (Ask people in retail around Xmas about how many parents let their kids destroy shit, then refuse to pay since it’s not THEIR fault, after all, who can control kids), then there wouldn’t be such a well-made, thickly-tarred brush to weild. Having seen the kids out there pulling this crap, again, I have no problem with limiting their access to such events.

    Yes scott, that’s all I do. In between presenting sessions on how regulatory actions affect Mac IT personnell and network monitoring tools and all the rest. Of course, you know it all. Blah. Blah.

    Speaking as a parent, kids aren’t inherently precious. There’s nothing special about breeding, billions do it every day. Sorry, but if you’re going to try to get me to subscribe to the “All things must be built for children’s convenience” cult, not happening.

  64. Actually, I have a 13 year old, and he’s not going to Macworld until I deem him able to handle himself by himself in a mature manner. If that means 18, so be it.

    And considering that I was ten when the Apple II was released, yes, I was at 13, quite in love with computers.

    I was also rather aware that there were places that I, as a 13 year old weren’t welcome due solely to my age. I didn’t like it, but it was an important lesson, namely, that the sun didn’t revolve around me. Just because I wanted something was not in fact, reason enough for me to get it.

    Maybe if there weren’t so many parents allowing their kids to be destructive idiots, and then refusing to take responsibility, (Ask people in retail around Xmas about how many parents let their kids destroy shit, then refuse to pay since it’s not THEIR fault, after all, who can control kids), then there wouldn’t be such a well-made, thickly-tarred brush to weild. Having seen the kids out there pulling this crap, again, I have no problem with limiting their access to such events.

    Yes scott, that’s all I do. In between presenting sessions on how regulatory actions affect Mac IT personnell and network monitoring tools and all the rest. Of course, you know it all. Blah. Blah.

    Speaking as a parent, kids aren’t inherently precious. There’s nothing special about breeding, billions do it every day. Sorry, but if you’re going to try to get me to subscribe to the “All things must be built for children’s convenience” cult, not happening.

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