Patrick not welcome at LinuxWorld

August 17, 2006 By

Ahh, when the Open Source folks wonder why using Linux isn’t “cool” you have no further to look than this sign for the reason — any conference where I can’t take my son and walk around is just something that’s going to have a hard time impressing me (hint: we both went to MacWorld with Dave Winer and then walked across the street and bought a Mac):

Thanks to Scott Beale for the photo.

Another data point? I haven’t been in Second Life since they told me my son isn’t welcome. Why not? Cause our time together is limited and might as well do things that let us play and learn together.

A big reason I am buying a Mac is so I can use iSight and iChat with Patrick (it’s a lot better quality if you have Macs on both sides of the conversation).

If you want me to use your technology you better figure out how to get Patrick first.

Anyway, everyone knows that 12-year-olds are a lot cooler and more up-to-date on technology than fat, white, 41-year-olds.

Aside: it’s nice as a manager to get photographic proof that your employees are working instead of playing Pacman or sitting on the beach. Damn, Irina and Eddie are getting some cool interviews lately! (That’s Craig Newmark, founder of Craig’s List, sitting behind Irina, and she’s interviewing Cmdr Taco, founder of Slashdot). Nice new Sony camera, huh?!?

Filed Under: 1

http://connectedworld.wordpress.com/ David

Shawn Fanning was about 19 when he came out with Napster. Probably was working on it when he was 18. This is the new world of business; you have kids 16-18 working on real products. When do you become a “business professional”? If you want Linux/Unix that is ready for primetime and your grandparents, get a Mac.
LayZ

@20. “when do you become a business professional?” when you have money do spend? Sure, there are plenty of examples of smart kids doing cool things. I mean, I saw “Baby Geniuses” so I know. . But, that doesn’t mean you open these types of events up to everyone. As others have said, there may be liability issues at play here. Who knows? But since Linux is “free” what are they missing out on? Aren’t there plenty of people out there to help these put upon kids get started?
LayZ

@20. “when do you become a business professional?” when you have money do spend? Sure, there are plenty of examples of smart kids doing cool things. I mean, I saw “Baby Geniuses” so I know. . But, that doesn’t mean you open these types of events up to everyone. As others have said, there may be liability issues at play here. Who knows? But since Linux is “free” what are they missing out on? Aren’t there plenty of people out there to help these put upon kids get started?
Karim

On the other hand, where do you have the cutoff? Do you allow babies in a conference?

Linux, Macintosh, Windows — these things are religions. It helps if you get people early, in their formative years. Apple has always understood that — why do you think they’ve always targeted the Education market? Why do terrorist groups fund madrasas? Why does McDonald’s sell Happy Meals? GET THEM WHEN THEY’RE YOUNG.

Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.

But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

— Matthew 6:13-14

I don’t know about babies, but the teenage years are PRIME geek years. Years when you can eat, sleep and breathe computers. If you’re going to exclude people, you should exclude the old farts who are set in their ways. Don’t preach to the choir.

I guarantee you that if I don’t realize there’s a stroller with a baby, or a very small child behind me, and I drop my backpack on them, that’s a dead kid. That thing weighs anywhere from 20 to 40 pounds depending on what i’m doing that day. From my shoulder to the ground is around 4 feet. Do the math.

Ok, so you’re in a crowded Starbucks, or on a bus, or in a line at McDonalds, and some mom comes up behind you pushing a stroller, and you scream, “Agghhhh!!! Get that kid away from me!!! Don’t you realize I’ve got a 40-pound laptop here???”

[cue dramatic news show theme]

NEWS ANCHOR: “Tonight on NewsCenter 4: Innocent children are being crushed by heavy backpacks dropped by careless adults.”

TEARFUL MOTHER: “The backpack just slipped off that man’s shoulder and flattened my little boy like a pancake… the doctor said he might have survived if it hadn’t been a ThinkPad…”

NEWS ANCHOR: “Is your child safe? A special investigative report, tonight at 11.”
Karim

On the other hand, where do you have the cutoff? Do you allow babies in a conference?

Linux, Macintosh, Windows — these things are religions. It helps if you get people early, in their formative years. Apple has always understood that — why do you think they’ve always targeted the Education market? Why do terrorist groups fund madrasas? Why does McDonald’s sell Happy Meals? GET THEM WHEN THEY’RE YOUNG.

Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.

But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

— Matthew 6:13-14

I don’t know about babies, but the teenage years are PRIME geek years. Years when you can eat, sleep and breathe computers. If you’re going to exclude people, you should exclude the old farts who are set in their ways. Don’t preach to the choir.

I guarantee you that if I don’t realize there’s a stroller with a baby, or a very small child behind me, and I drop my backpack on them, that’s a dead kid. That thing weighs anywhere from 20 to 40 pounds depending on what i’m doing that day. From my shoulder to the ground is around 4 feet. Do the math.

Ok, so you’re in a crowded Starbucks, or on a bus, or in a line at McDonalds, and some mom comes up behind you pushing a stroller, and you scream, “Agghhhh!!! Get that kid away from me!!! Don’t you realize I’ve got a 40-pound laptop here???”

[cue dramatic news show theme]

NEWS ANCHOR: “Tonight on NewsCenter 4: Innocent children are being crushed by heavy backpacks dropped by careless adults.”

TEARFUL MOTHER: “The backpack just slipped off that man’s shoulder and flattened my little boy like a pancake… the doctor said he might have survived if it hadn’t been a ThinkPad…”

NEWS ANCHOR: “Is your child safe? A special investigative report, tonight at 11.”
Karim

D’oh! Matthew chapter 19, not 6.
Karim

D’oh! Matthew chapter 19, not 6.
Karim

Does anyone even know the reason why?

I just finished reading the entertaining, Hunter S. Thompsonesque ValleyWag coverage of LinuxWorld (here and here.)

A quote:

Of all the exhibits on the show floor, none is as polarizing as Dice.com. This booth, clad in aging hotties and a tap of Bud Light, has been torturing attendees by demanding they search for better employment, right in front of their bosses. Plus, the poor bastard stuck in the big fuzzy dice costume is making an ass of him or her self just outside the entryway to the floor. But, hey, free beer!

Soooo… it would seem that the age requirement is due to the presence of booth babes and beer (as in free).

I guess ogling “aging hotties” while knocking back plastic cups of Bud Light (yum!) is a pleasure that should be reserved for, ahem, “business professionals.”

The good thing about the beer (as in free) is that it makes the hotties look younger and younger, and it makes Linux fonts look more and more antialiased. LOL
Karim

Does anyone even know the reason why?

I just finished reading the entertaining, Hunter S. Thompsonesque ValleyWag coverage of LinuxWorld (here and here.)

A quote:

Of all the exhibits on the show floor, none is as polarizing as Dice.com. This booth, clad in aging hotties and a tap of Bud Light, has been torturing attendees by demanding they search for better employment, right in front of their bosses. Plus, the poor bastard stuck in the big fuzzy dice costume is making an ass of him or her self just outside the entryway to the floor. But, hey, free beer!

Soooo… it would seem that the age requirement is due to the presence of booth babes and beer (as in free).

I guess ogling “aging hotties” while knocking back plastic cups of Bud Light (yum!) is a pleasure that should be reserved for, ahem, “business professionals.”

The good thing about the beer (as in free) is that it makes the hotties look younger and younger, and it makes Linux fonts look more and more antialiased. LOL
http://joeduck.wordpress.com/ joeduck

Right on. Many teens take their computing a LOT more seriously than marketing suit people, and since they teens can’t drink at the conference they’d get more work done. SES San Jose also banned “under 18s”. These decisions reflect the fact that conferences are more about making money than about teaching and informing. Kudos to MashupCamp.com where young people were *welcomed* (though few were there).
http://joeduck.wordpress.com/ joeduck

Right on. Many teens take their computing a LOT more seriously than marketing suit people, and since they teens can’t drink at the conference they’d get more work done. SES San Jose also banned “under 18s”. These decisions reflect the fact that conferences are more about making money than about teaching and informing. Kudos to MashupCamp.com where young people were *welcomed* (though few were there).
http://www.bloggingforbusinessbook.com/ Ted Demopoulos

Bunch of wankers! Of course I mean that most professionally
http://www.bloggingforbusinessbook.com Ted Demopoulos

Bunch of wankers! Of course I mean that most professionally
http://www.minequest.com Phil

If you are looking for quality on the video conferencing side of things with your son, check out SightSpeed. I use it often and it blows away anything else that I’ve ever seen. One of the nicest features is that you can do one-on-one conferencing for free. If you want to have up to four participants it will cost you $50 a year.

I use it when I travel to chat with my favorite niece and nephew and you can get 30fps video going through this thing.

Check out their website at: http://www.sightspeed.com

I’m a very satisified user.
http://www.minequest.com/ Phil

If you are looking for quality on the video conferencing side of things with your son, check out SightSpeed. I use it often and it blows away anything else that I’ve ever seen. One of the nicest features is that you can do one-on-one conferencing for free. If you want to have up to four participants it will cost you $50 a year.

I use it when I travel to chat with my favorite niece and nephew and you can get 30fps video going through this thing.

Check out their website at: http://www.sightspeed.com

I’m a very satisified user.
http://jonquil.livejournal.com/ Jonquil

My 13-year-old son has been playing Second Life for nearly a year… Within the last couple of months they officially waved the white flag and announced they would be combining the teen server and adult servers because they had so many masquerading children. (My son has had quite a lot to say about how to behave so as not to be unmasked as a child. I consider this valuable education in etiquette.

signed, enabling mother
http://jonquil.livejournal.com Jonquil

My 13-year-old son has been playing Second Life for nearly a year… Within the last couple of months they officially waved the white flag and announced they would be combining the teen server and adult servers because they had so many masquerading children. (My son has had quite a lot to say about how to behave so as not to be unmasked as a child. I consider this valuable education in etiquette.

signed, enabling mother
Christopher Coulter

Nice new Sony camera, huh?!?

Oh it’s a dream, minus the crappy 24P, as their Cineframe emu pales in comparison to the DVX100A or the AG-HVX200 24P. But otherwise, great.
Christopher Coulter

Nice new Sony camera, huh?!?

Oh it’s a dream, minus the crappy 24P, as their Cineframe emu pales in comparison to the DVX100A or the AG-HVX200 24P. But otherwise, great.
http://www.bynkii.com/ John C. Welch

Karim,

I don’t stand in line at a McDonalds for an hour without sitting, then go to another part of the restaurant and stand THERE for an hour without sitting, and so forth for 12 hours.

I do however, do that very thing during a Macworld. When I drop that backpack off my shoulders, I’m not looking DOWN to see if anyone’s there, I’m looking ACROSS, because i don’t expect babies. That’s one reason why i’m glad for the “no stroller” rule at macworld. That and too many people are entitlement queens and have those SUV strollers that take up an entire aisle and then some.

I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.
http://www.bynkii.com/ John C. Welch

Karim,

I don’t stand in line at a McDonalds for an hour without sitting, then go to another part of the restaurant and stand THERE for an hour without sitting, and so forth for 12 hours.

I do however, do that very thing during a Macworld. When I drop that backpack off my shoulders, I’m not looking DOWN to see if anyone’s there, I’m looking ACROSS, because i don’t expect babies. That’s one reason why i’m glad for the “no stroller” rule at macworld. That and too many people are entitlement queens and have those SUV strollers that take up an entire aisle and then some.

I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.
http://www.bynkii.com/ John C. Welch

Karim,

I don’t stand in line at a McDonalds for an hour without sitting, then go to another part of the restaurant and stand THERE for an hour without sitting, and so forth for 12 hours.

I do however, do that very thing during a Macworld. When I drop that backpack off my shoulders, I’m not looking DOWN to see if anyone’s there, I’m looking ACROSS, because i don’t expect babies. That’s one reason why i’m glad for the “no stroller” rule at macworld. That and too many people are entitlement queens and have those SUV strollers that take up an entire aisle and then some.

I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.
Karim

I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.

There’s a bit in the novel The Virgin Suicides where a doctor addresses a girl who has tried to commit suicide. He tells her she isn’t old enough to know how bad life gets, and in reply, she says, “Obviously, Doctor, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old girl.”

When you said you fail to see the need for anyone under 16-18 at a computer expo, my thought was, Obviously, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old boy in love with computers.
Karim

I fail to see the reason for anyone under about 16-18 at a conference.

There’s a bit in the novel The Virgin Suicides where a doctor addresses a girl who has tried to commit suicide. He tells her she isn’t old enough to know how bad life gets, and in reply, she says, “Obviously, Doctor, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old girl.”

When you said you fail to see the need for anyone under 16-18 at a computer expo, my thought was, Obviously, you’ve never been a thirteen-year-old boy in love with computers.
Karim

signed, enabling mother

You. Rock.
Karim

signed, enabling mother

You. Rock.
Scott

John Welch, you are a bonehead. You want teenagers to prove themselves, but you want them banned from everything. Uh… how are they going to prove themselves again?

You also tar all teenagers with the same feather (sorry, was hankering for a new mismatched metaphor, thanks) but don’t see the point that MOST people would only bring kids if they were interested in computers to begin with. At least I certainly hope so.

Curmudgeons like you shouldn’t have kids, I certainly hope you never do. You are too busy being focused on yourself, and people like that should not reproduce.
Scott

John Welch, you are a bonehead. You want teenagers to prove themselves, but you want them banned from everything. Uh… how are they going to prove themselves again?

You also tar all teenagers with the same feather (sorry, was hankering for a new mismatched metaphor, thanks) but don’t see the point that MOST people would only bring kids if they were interested in computers to begin with. At least I certainly hope so.

Curmudgeons like you shouldn’t have kids, I certainly hope you never do. You are too busy being focused on yourself, and people like that should not reproduce.
Scott

Oh, yeah, one more thing John – if you can’t take off your backpack without dropping it on the floor behind you constantly, YOU are the idiot, not anyone smaller than you. What if a little person goes to this event? Would you like to ban them too? Are you really so clumsy you can’t take off a backpack without crushing them and do you really think this should become everyone else’s problem instead of yours?

Admit it, you are the babe-oogling, beer drinking type who doesn’t want kids to mess up your conference.

Re the above, why can’t these supposed professionals wait until they have LEFT the conference for the evening before they start drinking and cheating on their wives? Why do we have to encourage the lack of discipline of a few idiots in nice suits?

Morons.
Scott

Oh, yeah, one more thing John – if you can’t take off your backpack without dropping it on the floor behind you constantly, YOU are the idiot, not anyone smaller than you. What if a little person goes to this event? Would you like to ban them too? Are you really so clumsy you can’t take off a backpack without crushing them and do you really think this should become everyone else’s problem instead of yours?

Admit it, you are the babe-oogling, beer drinking type who doesn’t want kids to mess up your conference.

Re the above, why can’t these supposed professionals wait until they have LEFT the conference for the evening before they start drinking and cheating on their wives? Why do we have to encourage the lack of discipline of a few idiots in nice suits?

Morons.
http://www.bynkii.com/ John C. Welch

Actually, I have a 13 year old, and he’s not going to Macworld until I deem him able to handle himself by himself in a mature manner. If that means 18, so be it.

And considering that I was ten when the Apple II was released, yes, I was at 13, quite in love with computers.

I was also rather aware that there were places that I, as a 13 year old weren’t welcome due solely to my age. I didn’t like it, but it was an important lesson, namely, that the sun didn’t revolve around me. Just because I wanted something was not in fact, reason enough for me to get it.

Maybe if there weren’t so many parents allowing their kids to be destructive idiots, and then refusing to take responsibility, (Ask people in retail around Xmas about how many parents let their kids destroy shit, then refuse to pay since it’s not THEIR fault, after all, who can control kids), then there wouldn’t be such a well-made, thickly-tarred brush to weild. Having seen the kids out there pulling this crap, again, I have no problem with limiting their access to such events.

Yes scott, that’s all I do. In between presenting sessions on how regulatory actions affect Mac IT personnell and network monitoring tools and all the rest. Of course, you know it all. Blah. Blah.

Speaking as a parent, kids aren’t inherently precious. There’s nothing special about breeding, billions do it every day. Sorry, but if you’re going to try to get me to subscribe to the “All things must be built for children’s convenience” cult, not happening.
http://www.bynkii.com/ John C. Welch

Actually, I have a 13 year old, and he’s not going to Macworld until I deem him able to handle himself by himself in a mature manner. If that means 18, so be it.

And considering that I was ten when the Apple II was released, yes, I was at 13, quite in love with computers.

I was also rather aware that there were places that I, as a 13 year old weren’t welcome due solely to my age. I didn’t like it, but it was an important lesson, namely, that the sun didn’t revolve around me. Just because I wanted something was not in fact, reason enough for me to get it.

Maybe if there weren’t so many parents allowing their kids to be destructive idiots, and then refusing to take responsibility, (Ask people in retail around Xmas about how many parents let their kids destroy shit, then refuse to pay since it’s not THEIR fault, after all, who can control kids), then there wouldn’t be such a well-made, thickly-tarred brush to weild. Having seen the kids out there pulling this crap, again, I have no problem with limiting their access to such events.

Yes scott, that’s all I do. In between presenting sessions on how regulatory actions affect Mac IT personnell and network monitoring tools and all the rest. Of course, you know it all. Blah. Blah.

Speaking as a parent, kids aren’t inherently precious. There’s nothing special about breeding, billions do it every day. Sorry, but if you’re going to try to get me to subscribe to the “All things must be built for children’s convenience” cult, not happening.
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Patrick not welcome at LinuxWorld

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