Cisco smacks back at Apple on its blog

This is pretty interesting blogging by Mark Chandler, Cisco’s SVP and General Counsel.

I’ve never seen a blog used like this.

This quote is a good one and is entirely correct. You think PodTech could do an “iPod service” without hearing from Apple’s lawyers? Absolutely not.

“At MacWorld, Apple discussed the patents pending on their new phone technology. They clearly seem to value intellectual property. If the tables were turned, do you think Apple would allow someone to blatantly infringe on their rights? ”

The BlogHaus is rocking (we had to shut the doors cause it’s so full, we have rappers and singer Samantha Murphy here doing songs). Paul Mooney brought this Cisco post to my attention. He hadn’t seen anything like it either.

It’s fun watching everyone blog here and having conversations with them both in real life (Paul is sitting next to me) and on my blog.

Comments

  1. Ya, a pretty good post.
    The thing I noticed was the 8:00pm time and no word that night or after the keynote. I don’t really find that surprising. Jobs is noted for rehersing late into the night and he’s one pretty busy guy doing interviews after his keynotes.
    And, since the sticking point was interoperability, I’d bet that isn’t something Apple can do/control, after all, the network belongs to Cingular. They’d probably have to consult with Cingular at the very least.
    So, could it be that Cisco jumped the gun with a lawsuit?

  2. Ya, a pretty good post.
    The thing I noticed was the 8:00pm time and no word that night or after the keynote. I don’t really find that surprising. Jobs is noted for rehersing late into the night and he’s one pretty busy guy doing interviews after his keynotes.
    And, since the sticking point was interoperability, I’d bet that isn’t something Apple can do/control, after all, the network belongs to Cingular. They’d probably have to consult with Cingular at the very least.
    So, could it be that Cisco jumped the gun with a lawsuit?

  3. Ooops…forgot…
    After all, they didn’t necessarily have to file today, they have six months before Apple actually infringes with a shipping product.

  4. Ooops…forgot…
    After all, they didn’t necessarily have to file today, they have six months before Apple actually infringes with a shipping product.

  5. Cisco is really naive if it thinks that it can bully Steve into submission by suing him. What a joke!

    Wall Street Journal:

    Apple spokesman Steve Dowling called the Cisco lawsuit “silly,” adding there are several companies using the term iPhone for VOIP products, and Cisco’s trademark is “tenuous at best.”

    “We’re the first company to ever use the iPhone name for a cellphone,” he said. “If Cisco wants to challenge us on it, we’re very confident we’ll prevail.”

  6. Cisco is really naive if it thinks that it can bully Steve into submission by suing him. What a joke!

    Wall Street Journal:

    Apple spokesman Steve Dowling called the Cisco lawsuit “silly,” adding there are several companies using the term iPhone for VOIP products, and Cisco’s trademark is “tenuous at best.”

    “We’re the first company to ever use the iPhone name for a cellphone,” he said. “If Cisco wants to challenge us on it, we’re very confident we’ll prevail.”

  7. Well this just helps Apple’s cause, nothing like a bit of controversy to get more publicity for a new concept.
    This thing will run and run

  8. Well this just helps Apple’s cause, nothing like a bit of controversy to get more publicity for a new concept.
    This thing will run and run

  9. Robert, your shows won’t play on the Apple TV the same way they don’t play on the iPod. Pure lock-in on Apple’s part. Tell the Xbox 360 guys to support more formats, including Divx.

  10. Robert, your shows won’t play on the Apple TV the same way they don’t play on the iPod. Pure lock-in on Apple’s part. Tell the Xbox 360 guys to support more formats, including Divx.

  11. I think its a great PR move and will gaurentee awaremness and brand recognition for all. If nothing else it will make for some great online mudslinging and fun news stories. Thanks for the link to the Cisco blog posting.

  12. I think its a great PR move and will gaurentee awaremness and brand recognition for all. If nothing else it will make for some great online mudslinging and fun news stories. Thanks for the link to the Cisco blog posting.

  13. Yes. There’s no argument that Apple can use here that makes them appear reasonable.

    Cisco has the iPhone trademark. Apple didn’t (and seemingly doesn’t) respect that. Why should anyone respect Apple’s IP now?

  14. Yes. There’s no argument that Apple can use here that makes them appear reasonable.

    Cisco has the iPhone trademark. Apple didn’t (and seemingly doesn’t) respect that. Why should anyone respect Apple’s IP now?

  15. It’s a non-issue. Either they’ll change the name to something more appropriate for the device or as Apple has stated, they’ll prevail. RDF back-up Robert!

  16. It’s a non-issue. Either they’ll change the name to something more appropriate for the device or as Apple has stated, they’ll prevail. RDF back-up Robert!

  17. A trademark is only a trademark when it is being protected. Just as Google politely asks us to stop using Google as a verb, just as Kimberly-Clark fights to keep people from referring to all tissues as Kleenex, all trademark owners must stake out their territory – or lose it. In England the Hoover corporation lost their battle and hoover has come to mean vacuuming the carpet.

    It is almost as if Apple owns the lowercase ‘i’ and this didn’t just happen yesterday, it started with the iMac and has been gaining strength ever since. Cisco is in a strange situation. Should it have begun defending ‘iPhone’ before their product even existed? Can Apple stake out ‘i’ for itself?

    For that matter, how can Cisco even begin to think about fighting this when the public mind has already ceded the iPhone to Apple?

  18. A trademark is only a trademark when it is being protected. Just as Google politely asks us to stop using Google as a verb, just as Kimberly-Clark fights to keep people from referring to all tissues as Kleenex, all trademark owners must stake out their territory – or lose it. In England the Hoover corporation lost their battle and hoover has come to mean vacuuming the carpet.

    It is almost as if Apple owns the lowercase ‘i’ and this didn’t just happen yesterday, it started with the iMac and has been gaining strength ever since. Cisco is in a strange situation. Should it have begun defending ‘iPhone’ before their product even existed? Can Apple stake out ‘i’ for itself?

    For that matter, how can Cisco even begin to think about fighting this when the public mind has already ceded the iPhone to Apple?

  19. Why should this surprise anyone. Have you forgotten the Apple vs Apple Computers lawsuit? Apple entered into agreements with the Beatles record company then disregarded it when it suited Apple Computers. When Apple inc. sued Apple Computers over these agreements they lost their latest round. That’s why you see the Apple name now and not Apple Computers. It’s what the record company lost out on in the last lawsuit.

  20. Why should this surprise anyone. Have you forgotten the Apple vs Apple Computers lawsuit? Apple entered into agreements with the Beatles record company then disregarded it when it suited Apple Computers. When Apple inc. sued Apple Computers over these agreements they lost their latest round. That’s why you see the Apple name now and not Apple Computers. It’s what the record company lost out on in the last lawsuit.

  21. First a few facts about Steve Jobs and Apple, and then let’s sit back and try to remember why we idolize this company.

    1. Steve Jobs loves himself more than his mother does.
    2. Steve loves his products more than his customers do.
    3. Steve is the first to cry fowl when someone copies off of something that was thought of in Cuppertino.
    4. Steve makes sure his company copies only the best of his compition, but unlike his competition, he calls all of it his innovation and doesn’t give credit where it’s due. (A sign of lack of character)
    5. The iPhone is great (bother companies iPhones actually) but Steve fails to admit that 95 percent of the innovation that went into it was done outside of apple. Most of it from Redmond as well as Palm and HTC and all those other great companies who have hard working employees as well. (their bosses don’t yell at them like children after working 90 hours like Steve Jobs does)
    6.Apple is the only company that doesn’t get grilled in today’s collaborative “Web 2.0″ world for not opening up and–Christ–even Microsoft designs sites that work in Firefox. I suggest we all start forcing apple to live up to the same standards as everyone else.

    At some point, I must separate myself from the Oooh Ahhh Niicce I think I’m cool because I wear an apple logo on my minivan crowd and take a stand against Apple. I will not support a company that acts like this any longer and I will continue to see people through a filter when they say things like Steve Jobs is great or something close to that.

  22. First a few facts about Steve Jobs and Apple, and then let’s sit back and try to remember why we idolize this company.

    1. Steve Jobs loves himself more than his mother does.
    2. Steve loves his products more than his customers do.
    3. Steve is the first to cry fowl when someone copies off of something that was thought of in Cuppertino.
    4. Steve makes sure his company copies only the best of his compition, but unlike his competition, he calls all of it his innovation and doesn’t give credit where it’s due. (A sign of lack of character)
    5. The iPhone is great (bother companies iPhones actually) but Steve fails to admit that 95 percent of the innovation that went into it was done outside of apple. Most of it from Redmond as well as Palm and HTC and all those other great companies who have hard working employees as well. (their bosses don’t yell at them like children after working 90 hours like Steve Jobs does)
    6.Apple is the only company that doesn’t get grilled in today’s collaborative “Web 2.0″ world for not opening up and–Christ–even Microsoft designs sites that work in Firefox. I suggest we all start forcing apple to live up to the same standards as everyone else.

    At some point, I must separate myself from the Oooh Ahhh Niicce I think I’m cool because I wear an apple logo on my minivan crowd and take a stand against Apple. I will not support a company that acts like this any longer and I will continue to see people through a filter when they say things like Steve Jobs is great or something close to that.

  23. @14. It was never “Apple Computers.” It was “Apple Computer” (singular). I wonder if seeing people add that alien “s” again and again didn’t help drive the decision to drop “Computer” from the corporate name.

  24. @14. It was never “Apple Computers.” It was “Apple Computer” (singular). I wonder if seeing people add that alien “s” again and again didn’t help drive the decision to drop “Computer” from the corporate name.

  25. Steve Jobs is the serpent :o Take a bite and you’ve sold your soul.
    Resist that temptation or you’ll be banished from the garden of electronics.

  26. Steve Jobs is the serpent :o Take a bite and you’ve sold your soul.
    Resist that temptation or you’ll be banished from the garden of electronics.

  27. We’ve seen this happen before (recently)… Apple v. Creative. THAT resulted in a hefty one-time sum being paid by Apple to Creative. We’ll see it again and Apple doesn’t seem to mind writing that particular check. Big deal.

    Go APPLE iPhone! (just grow up quickly please I need storage, battery and other network options)

  28. We’ve seen this happen before (recently)… Apple v. Creative. THAT resulted in a hefty one-time sum being paid by Apple to Creative. We’ll see it again and Apple doesn’t seem to mind writing that particular check. Big deal.

    Go APPLE iPhone! (just grow up quickly please I need storage, battery and other network options)

  29. Cisco should partner with another cell phone maker and release an iPhone before June. That’s the way I would do it. Slap an iPhone sticker on one of the cool Asian phones (or all of them for that matter) just to rub it in Apple’s face.

  30. Cisco should partner with another cell phone maker and release an iPhone before June. That’s the way I would do it. Slap an iPhone sticker on one of the cool Asian phones (or all of them for that matter) just to rub it in Apple’s face.

  31. Cisco guy definitely knows how to blog effectively-really well done.

    And Robert, make sure you snapshot this Techmeme moment and remember it next time you think Apple only gets fawning press and a “pass” on everything-its obvious both their successes AND flaws get magnified by the press/bloggers, something that competitors tend to gloss over.

  32. Cisco guy definitely knows how to blog effectively-really well done.

    And Robert, make sure you snapshot this Techmeme moment and remember it next time you think Apple only gets fawning press and a “pass” on everything-its obvious both their successes AND flaws get magnified by the press/bloggers, something that competitors tend to gloss over.

  33. Reports are surfacing that Cisco is filtering the comments on that blog post. Filtering out contraian (pro Apple) views. If true, makes it a PR stunt rather than a blog post discussion. What do other think?

  34. Reports are surfacing that Cisco is filtering the comments on that blog post. Filtering out contraian (pro Apple) views. If true, makes it a PR stunt rather than a blog post discussion. What do other think?

  35. PXLated – Its useless to filter content on a blog. The conversation will carry one elsewhere.
    Maybe they are just deleting obscene comments.

  36. PXLated – Its useless to filter content on a blog. The conversation will carry one elsewhere.
    Maybe they are just deleting obscene comments.

  37. I agree with those that call this a PR bonanza. OK, I’m a PR guy so I’ll see things through that lens anyway. I’m sure the Apple lawyers remember a little letter they sent to Podcast Ready this fall.

  38. I agree with those that call this a PR bonanza. OK, I’m a PR guy so I’ll see things through that lens anyway. I’m sure the Apple lawyers remember a little letter they sent to Podcast Ready this fall.

  39. Cisco should partner with another cell phone maker and release an iPhone before June

    Oh yeah, compete against Apple.. Nice try.. bring it on

    Mac users have been chuckling at Windows for 20 fuckin years.. let’s see what else you guys can come up with..

  40. Cisco should partner with another cell phone maker and release an iPhone before June

    Oh yeah, compete against Apple.. Nice try.. bring it on

    Mac users have been chuckling at Windows for 20 fuckin years.. let’s see what else you guys can come up with..

  41. “useless to filter”…I agree. Could this blowup in Cisco’s face if it’s not just filtering obscentities? Could it go from being a good example of using a blog to being the way not to use a blog?

  42. “useless to filter”…I agree. Could this blowup in Cisco’s face if it’s not just filtering obscentities? Could it go from being a good example of using a blog to being the way not to use a blog?

  43. “Now that Microsoft is doing more and more hardware, will they consider a corporate name change as well?”

    Yes, it’ll now be: Micro & Soft.

  44. “Now that Microsoft is doing more and more hardware, will they consider a corporate name change as well?”

    Yes, it’ll now be: Micro & Soft.

  45. The term intellectual property is such a farce. Companies will do anything to make a buck and protect it. IP is one method of kind of keeping the competition from developing something similar/better. I am in complete agreement with Richard Stallman on IP. Copyright/copyleft is fine. Patents are fine. IP is crap. Full stop.
    Protect their phone. Whatever. This new phone of theirs is going to bomb out compared to the ipod. There is NO way this phone will sell in any meaningful numbers.

    Sheeple, er, geeks with more money than sense will buy the phone. Rich people who think they’re hot will buy the phone. Mom and pop will not. Kids will not unless their parents have more money than sense.

  46. The term intellectual property is such a farce. Companies will do anything to make a buck and protect it. IP is one method of kind of keeping the competition from developing something similar/better. I am in complete agreement with Richard Stallman on IP. Copyright/copyleft is fine. Patents are fine. IP is crap. Full stop.
    Protect their phone. Whatever. This new phone of theirs is going to bomb out compared to the ipod. There is NO way this phone will sell in any meaningful numbers.

    Sheeple, er, geeks with more money than sense will buy the phone. Rich people who think they’re hot will buy the phone. Mom and pop will not. Kids will not unless their parents have more money than sense.

  47. >Mac users have been chuckling at Windows for 20 fuckin >years.. let’s see what else you guys can come up >with..
    >
    >Comment by mike

    And yet in the real world, Windows seems to be the most popular OS in the world… Chuckle away to yourselves and Go Cisco!

  48. >Mac users have been chuckling at Windows for 20 fuckin >years.. let’s see what else you guys can come up >with..
    >
    >Comment by mike

    And yet in the real world, Windows seems to be the most popular OS in the world… Chuckle away to yourselves and Go Cisco!

  49. To all those macfans: Will it be ok if other people start copying or improving on jPhone’s 200+ patents?

  50. To all those macfans: Will it be ok if other people start copying or improving on jPhone’s 200+ patents?

  51. First of all: this is not an IP dispute – why does the Cisco guy mention this ?

    Second: Cisco has not been enforcing the trademark. Plain and simple – you dont enforce it, you lose it.

  52. First of all: this is not an IP dispute – why does the Cisco guy mention this ?

    Second: Cisco has not been enforcing the trademark. Plain and simple – you dont enforce it, you lose it.

  53. Chandler may be regretting this blog post after this news coming out:

    http://blogs.zdnet.com/Burnette/?p=236

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/01/12/cisco_apple_iphone_trademark_spat/

    “We shipped and/or supported that iPhone product for years. We have been shipping new, updated iPhone products since last spring, and had a formal launch late last year.” = LIE!

    Seems like “negotiating in good faith” means a last dirch effort to squeeze some value out of “IP” we weren’t using.

  54. Chandler may be regretting this blog post after this news coming out:

    http://blogs.zdnet.com/Burnette/?p=236

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/01/12/cisco_apple_iphone_trademark_spat/

    “We shipped and/or supported that iPhone product for years. We have been shipping new, updated iPhone products since last spring, and had a formal launch late last year.” = LIE!

    Seems like “negotiating in good faith” means a last dirch effort to squeeze some value out of “IP” we weren’t using.

  55. Yes, Chandler has allowed access to the Net to turn him into a fool. His admission that he tried to use the iPhone trademark issue to force a shotgun marriage between Cisco and Apple will be evidence if the case goes to trial. Cisco may have the trademark, but negotiating in bad faith puts it in the wrong ethically.

    The comments on his blog have an interesting bifurcation. His supporters keep repeating a party line, ‘Cisco is being open and Apple needs to be put in its place.’ Obviously, they’ve arrived from this and other blogs spouting that meme. The opposition, instead of such vacuous behavior, has researched the issues and caught Chandler in lies about protecting the trademark and strategy.

  56. Yes, Chandler has allowed access to the Net to turn him into a fool. His admission that he tried to use the iPhone trademark issue to force a shotgun marriage between Cisco and Apple will be evidence if the case goes to trial. Cisco may have the trademark, but negotiating in bad faith puts it in the wrong ethically.

    The comments on his blog have an interesting bifurcation. His supporters keep repeating a party line, ‘Cisco is being open and Apple needs to be put in its place.’ Obviously, they’ve arrived from this and other blogs spouting that meme. The opposition, instead of such vacuous behavior, has researched the issues and caught Chandler in lies about protecting the trademark and strategy.

  57. Podesta, the hilarious thing is it is just a PR… he hasn’t posted since or replied to comments… There’s no way he’ll continue the conversation beyond this PR friendly statement… but because it appears under a “blog” instead of the PR section of Cisco’s website, it’s BRILLIANT!

    Yeah, whatver dumb@ss bloggers.

  58. Podesta, the hilarious thing is it is just a PR… he hasn’t posted since or replied to comments… There’s no way he’ll continue the conversation beyond this PR friendly statement… but because it appears under a “blog” instead of the PR section of Cisco’s website, it’s BRILLIANT!

    Yeah, whatver dumb@ss bloggers.

  59. “Steve is the first to cry fowl..”
    You mean like a chicken?
    I think you mean: Steve is the first to cry foul…

    Other than that, jeez Jason, you have some real anger issues with Stevey, eh?
    Get a grip son, your anger really clouds your logic. “95 percent of the innovation that went into it was done outside of apple. Most of it from Redmond as well as Palm and HTC…” Where did 95% come from? Have a cool drink and a lie down…

  60. “Steve is the first to cry fowl..”
    You mean like a chicken?
    I think you mean: Steve is the first to cry foul…

    Other than that, jeez Jason, you have some real anger issues with Stevey, eh?
    Get a grip son, your anger really clouds your logic. “95 percent of the innovation that went into it was done outside of apple. Most of it from Redmond as well as Palm and HTC…” Where did 95% come from? Have a cool drink and a lie down…

  61. “And yet in the real world, Windows seems to be the most popular OS in the world… Chuckle away to yourselves and Go Cisco!”

    Hardly. It makes people rip their hair out… and exists to keep IT Managers employed.

    Windows users wring their hands and Mac owners love their machines.

    Hi-five Windows apologist, you’re using a 5 year old OS.

  62. “And yet in the real world, Windows seems to be the most popular OS in the world… Chuckle away to yourselves and Go Cisco!”

    Hardly. It makes people rip their hair out… and exists to keep IT Managers employed.

    Windows users wring their hands and Mac owners love their machines.

    Hi-five Windows apologist, you’re using a 5 year old OS.

  63. This suit has been settled and both Apple and Cisco has “hugged it out”, as some bloggers have put it. Both sides are going to work hand in hand to make sure their products will have compatibility with each other. I think that was the original plan to begin with on Cisco’s part, otherwise they could have just gone for a monetary gain.

    http://t1buyersguide.com

  64. This suit has been settled and both Apple and Cisco has “hugged it out”, as some bloggers have put it. Both sides are going to work hand in hand to make sure their products will have compatibility with each other. I think that was the original plan to begin with on Cisco’s part, otherwise they could have just gone for a monetary gain.

    http://t1buyersguide.com