2007 Scoblecars

Hybrids are great on PR, but the tech is lacking. I’ve a friend with a Diesel Jetta who will spank your hybrid on mileage, and he’s running half and half old veggie oil from BK and actual “diesel” fuel.

He can pull off 50+ without trying hard, and 60MPG or so if he works at it.

Synchronicity. I just bought a car today. I posted about it here: http://aezell.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/buying-a-car/

I’m really curious about this – I never really understand why people buy new cars, especially at those prices.

I guess it’s usually for status, but tbh I guess I didn’t have you down as a status kind of guy.

So – how exactly do you guys justify spending $40k on a car? Or even $25k? Is the market for second hand cars in the US sucky, or something? Is the US really so pedestrian/public transport unfriendly?

If your car was full of cool tech, maybe I’d understand it, but you just said that it wasn’t .

So, $65k for 2 cars for 2 people. Is there really nothing better you can spend your money on?

I’m serious – I’m not having a go at you; I’m genuinely curious.

Tim: until about two years ago I drove an Acura with 180,000 miles. Before that I didn’t have a car, I rode my bike and train to work at UserLand back in 2002.

Why buy a new car instead of having some used car? Very easy: they are nicer. Much nicer.

Because of my job and lifestyle I entertain a LOT of people in my car and I MUST be to interviews on time. I remember giving rides to many geeks in my old Acura (including Tim O’Reilly and many other famous geeks). Often times I’d get a funny look as to my choice of car. Several of them praised my buying a new car when I did (I think they were scared that the old Acura would die, or worse, while they were in it. Or maybe the cracked seats just made them itchy. Heheh).

I also spend at least 1.25 hours in my car every day (Maryam and I often ride together) and that’s just the start. Most days you can add another hour, due to my driving to interviews. Every other weekend I need to drive to Petaluma to pick Patrick up. That’s a two hour drive each way.

Having a really nice car makes a HUGE difference in my enjoyment of life.

I’m getting older. I’m starting to see the end of the tunnel. My mom died at 66. I’m 42. I’ve seen lots of people die in their 40s lately.

I made a decision to enjoy life. Having a nice car is a huge part of that.

I could have fixed my Ford for $2,300 and had a perfectly usable car. But, the new Saturn is TONS nicer of a car. So much smoother of a ride. Tons more airbags in case something nasty happens. Better brakes. Better stereo. Better interior. More leg room for Patrick. The AC works (my Ford was getting weak). And I don’t need to worry about whether my car is going to need to be in the shop anytime soon which makes my life less stressful. Plus, anyone who rides in my car will have a better time too.

But, it isn’t for everyone. Not having payments is a lot less stressful for many people. Having a beat-up old Acura like I used to have is a much better deal for those people.

I find it quite amusing that out of the cars we own (Honda Odyssey minivan, Jaguar S-series, and Chevy Colorado), I like my truck the best. That on-star, the XM Radio, and yes, I actually like NOT having leather seats. The Honda has leather, heated, the Jag does not. And DVD systems for the kids in the van amusingly put the minivan about the Jag.

Yet I keep coming back to my truck. It retailed for 28K, I walked with it for 24K, same model year.

Tim’s comment is interesting, since I think 60K is my personal cutoff. There’s only one car worth 100K, most everything you can get for 60-80, you can probably find for 40-60.

Volkswagen had the funniest, they had a 70,000 luxury car: The Phaeton. If I’m gonna spend 70 on a car, it’s gonna be a Mercedes, and NOT a v-dub. Not just for brand, but the quality of MBZ is untouchable (yeah yeah your taxis, our luxury cars).

And yes, outside of some big cities (SF bloggers are all up in MUNI, I can think of like 2 that have cars), we hate public transport. We love our cars, and barely carpool.

Now we can talk about spending 20K on a car and adding 60K worth of technology and zazz to it, but I’m thinking this is the wrong crowd to get drooly over car culture.

I’ll be in my garage if anyone needs me.

Also, I remember reading some story or post someone made about how ‘oh, well Google employees would _never_ be seen in a Mercedes convertible!’ and all I could think of is how amazing that statement was since MBZ I think is the best of the best of the best. Would they have held that if they had something as bad-ass as an Apple on four wheels raging down the freeway? Dunno. I can’t believe that techies are THAT kumbaya.

Gimme a $100k+ Mercedes SL AMG roadster any day of the week, and I’ll see you at the finish line, alive, on time, and in style.

Eric: Patrick just got a brand new MacBookPro, so that’ll be his back-seat DVD system. He says that the back seat is a lot more comfortable in the Saturn that than it is in the BMW.

How do you say “Scoble”?

How do you say “Scoble”?

Gabe: as long as you get the URL right, I don’t care how you say it!

Eric: if I were a billionaire, I’d have an SLR. They are selling for $750,000 (list price is $350,000).

When people spend a lot of time in their cars they decide to spend some money on them.

Second hand cars are a crap shoot in my experience. You don’t know the history, typically have next to no warranty and they certainly have no sexiness about them.

My car cost about half my gross salary. The payment with a 6 year loan is about 10% of my take home, which equates to about 4 hours of week of my work.

I love my car. I still get goosebumps looking at it. And it only costs 4 hours a week of my work to enjoy it. To me, it feels like a good deal.

What else can I spend the money on? I eat well, I have a nice house, I have some investments. Why not enjoy my life? My car makes me smile every time I drive it.

If you are not into cars then get a stripped down Honda or VW on a lease and pay next to nothing.

Ben makes a good point…I’m reminded of the Mercedes commercial here in LA that says “…around here, you gotta love what you drive.” I wonder how much Ben has to commute in his car, and how that factors into his equation about 4 hours of work. I drive a 15 year old Miata, which I love, bought for $18k used w/12k miles on it…it now has 112,000 miles and will go another 100k for sure…I’m getting my money out of it which relates to the earlier query that Tim made and Robert’s response…also, watch for my next podcast with OnStar’s Chet Huber….

Ben: are you talking about your yellow car? That’s hot.

Funny enough I also have a commute where a great handling car actually makes sense (look at HWY 92 on Google Maps sometime — between Half Moon Bay and Redwood City — it’s curvy!)

You probably know this already–don’t store your BMW keys side-by-side. Close proximity for hours on end will flatten their charges to a point that they won’t recharge in the ignition.

I discovered this little issue after buying two BMWs and running each of the more than 150,000 miles. In Ireland, I can get them recharged for free. You need to recode (recharge) both of them together if you want their remote unlocking to work following this simple maintenance.

Bernie: I didn’t know that. Thanks!

Does the BMW 3 series start without requiring key to be inserted into ignition? If it doesn’t, then the Camry definitely has the cooler key. The whole push Start button to start thing is really cool…does take some getting used to though.

Also don’t forget that the Camry has Bluetooth in it.

Oh and the Camry does have an XM satellite enabled radio, but you of course have to pay for the service.

Lastly, too bad the German car manufacturers are the only ones really pushing turbo diesels as they all have much worse reliability than the Japanese manufacturers. Maybe if I was given one, I’d drive a VW, but I’d never buy one on my own.

Alex: thanks, I didn’t know that about the Camry key. That definitely is cooler.

All three of our cars use Bluetooth.

Did the Camry come with the XM service turned on? My Saturn did — three months of included service. Much better user experience.

Interesting – I was wondering how much extra driving you did for the Podtech interviews (now you’re not limited to the MS campus ), and if that was a factor. The drive to Petaluma is also a big factor, I guess.

My perspective is skewed somewhat, because I live just outside London, and the travel links to central London are pretty good, and I don’t often need to go anywhere but London for business. And driving into London is both pretty stupid and pretty selfish.

That said, I do have a car, but I only use it to drive to friends’ houses or to visit my parents. I could use the train to visit my parents, but that tends to add about 1.5 hours to the journey, and if I want to carry much, then forget it. My car is an old Mazda, and every so often I think about getting a newer one, but I can never get past [a] the expense, and [b] the fact that I’d be (however small) creating a demand for a new car at the top of the chain, with all its associated environmental factors. Plus, these damn Japanese cars seem to keep going for ever.

I could just be being hypocritical though, and if I had the money, I’d buy a nice car. It just seems different people have different ways of assessing how much money they have for a new car. For instance, I’d have to be earning a *lot* more than I do now to consider getting a BMW.

Your driving habits along with the US’ general pedestrian unfriendliness* are probably a good argument – although the “I might die soon” argument is an intriguing one .

“You probably know this already–don’t store your BMW keys side-by-side. Close proximity for hours on end will flatten their charges to a point that they won’t recharge in the ignition.”

Ah, that must be the legendary German engineering quality that BMW owners end up paying for

(* My experience of US cities is limited to Seattle, Atlanta, and SF. Having a car seemed to be a pre-requisite for life in all 3 cities. In Atlanta, I was with 2 other Brits, and we wanted to go to a store near the hotel. We saw the mall as soon as we left the hotel, and we were all like, “Hey! Let’s walk!” *BIG* mistake I think all the people in cars thought we were homeless.)

Oh, and as for people who give you funny looks when they get in your car – screw ‘em. If they can’t see past the car you drive they’re often not worth knowing (except in a cynical sense).

Tim: if I lived near London I probably wouldn’t own a car either. You totally nailed it. EUrope has much better public transportation systems. Here we have NONE at all. I can’t get to work using public transport.

Yeah, I’m driving a LOT more than I used to at Microsoft.

Better than a built-in nav system is a Garmin nuvi. I did not get the upgrade on my Toyota Prius for the nav system and I don’t regret it. The nuvi is much less expensive and you can take it in any car you own and on foot – a big plus in NYC. We’re spending January in Florida this year, and the nuvi has been indispensable for getting us around.

Actually, public transport in London (and the UK as a whole) is not a great experience at all. Pretty unreliable, and often dirty and dangerously overcrowded. And, if you want to go anywhere after midnight, you can pretty much forget it – cos the public transport system just about shuts down.

Oh, and aside from being unreliable, and not running when you want it to, it’s *really* expensive. I drive a Porsche 911. Trust me – that is an expensive car to run. And it’s cheaper to drive a Porsche 911 somewhere than it is to go by train (taking all costs into account). And that’s with one person in the car. With two people in the car, the savings over using the train are significant.

“…bluer in color and brighter, too.” So, oncoming traffic is distracted by that odd thing coming at them, and very possibly dazzled, too. And that’s a good thing?

Behind the “theoretically better illumination”, ask yourself how much of the time are you driving in a situation where more conventional lighting is really inadequate?

Couple of thoughts:

Matt – Chrysler is now part of Daimler, not the other way around. The Germans bailed the American company out by coming in an throwing awesome prodct knowledge and technology at a company that had lost its way.

I drive a late-model 325i (2003 that I bought this year with only 38K on it in pristine shape). Cost-wise, my payments are about the same as if I’d bought the Saturn Robert’s driving. No question in my mind which I’m happier with (even without the backseat radio).

Robert, if you seriously aren’t sure which of the three Scoble cars handles best, we’ll take a drive on PCH next time I’m in the Bay area and I’ll show you in about 30 seconds why Maryam’s car is in a completely different class from the other two. No contest.

David – have you ever driven down to Half Moon Bay where Robert lives? Depending on the route, it can get pretty dark/ Have you driven a car with zeon lamps? I live in the high mountain desert of New Mexico where it is pitch black once you’re out of the city and I will never drive a car without blue lamps again.

Yeah I am talking about the yellow car

My commute can take 10 minutes or 30 depending on the traffic, but the weather could be anything from 30 to 90 degrees in Seattle. Another factor I forgot to mention is that the more you pay for a car the better the climate control will tend to be.

Robert – is that road that collapsed near Half Moon Bay fixed yet or is it still out of action? That looked like part of a fun (but scary) drive.