Steve Jobs alert: Killer Java app for iPhone

Robert.. Radar is totally killer. Glad you picked up on it

Yes, Mobile 2.0! Eric Schmidt hits it -- "Mobile phones are cheaper than PCs, there are three times more of them, growing at twice the speed, and they increasingly have Internet access."

I agree. I haven't seen a web 2.0 site that's stood out and made me want to cry it was so beautiful in a while. I think we're transitioning into a sort of technology 2.0. Everything seems to be innovating and expanding into new markets and new technologies, it's really exciting. I can't wait for my iPhone. I will put Java on that device if it's the last thing I do =D

Well, i have already touched one of the Iphones, and what i saw was amazing. The graphics are very original. The iphone will include one or two games when shipped out. More will be released for download but you have to buy them. There is a racing game which is amazing. I was so impressed with this phone. And also there are somethings that they never mentioned that will amaze people alot. There are no words to explain how this phone works. And by the way, apple has made it so that this would be the first phone without any glitches... This is so people wont complain of it reseting or turning off. They made sue it was perfect.

"Mobile 2.0". Yay! Welcome to the party ;-)

The Apple iphone will be a disappointment inasmuch as it'll be locked down so tightly that revolutionary apps like radar will not work.

How sure are you it doesn't have a Java Runtime? (granted... you DO talk with the one guy who would know if anyone outside Infinite Loop does...) :)

Who wants stupid shit like this other than fat 40 year old dudes who think that they're miraculously in touch with what kids want these days.

Robert, can you explain why Radar needs Java? I don't get it. It looks like it is email/sms of a picture to the Radar site where it can be shared. Nothing of that needs Java. I haven't really looked at the Radar site so please enlighten me.

Ok... so I can't run GMail. I can't run Yahoo! Go. I can't run Radar. I can't run Google Maps. So tell me again, other than feeling swanky and groovy, why I'd want to part with $500 for an iPhone? Rumor has it Google's working on a phone, I wonder what platform they're going to support... am I missing something?

James: I'll get the video up in a couple of weeks. But, it does a lot more than that and displays it in a much cooler way than a Web site or email would display pictures. It also is a social network, not just a picture sharing site.

Steve jobs is dead right, and I'm glad somebody is finally speaking the truth about Java. For years I have been listening to technocrats praise while everyone I know who actually uses a computer steers clear of Java apps like the plague and doesn't use them unless there is absolutely no other tool that can do the job.

Bottom line: compared to the performance expectations developed by the users of any given platform, the Java version of any function is dog slow, and I often find myself wishing it had never existed so somebody would have an incentive to code it the *right* way.

Make no mistake: Java gets you easier cross-platform and return it sacrifices everything else.

The idea of transplanting this always-several-notches-down user experience to something like a mobile phone makes me shudder.

No java support is a feature. Glad somebody finally has balls to implement it.

Hey, Paul - you live on the PC. In the mobile world, Java's da bomb, and has been for years. None of that desktop hangup/headache, great performance and tools, and a huge ecosystem to play with. So stop hanging out with the wrong age bracket, dude...

Robert,
Where do you get this mystery Java app? I don't see anything on the Radar site that mentions it.

Hi Robert,

You need to track what's happening in northern europe and Japan a Lot more; I keep hearing about what are meant to be realy cool leap-ahead mobile apps/services on american blogs, but to me in the UK they don't seem that especially special!

Great Blog Obviously. :)
(1st comment here!)

Kind regards,


Shakir Razak

Also, Robert,

As we're talking (discussing) about Java, and how cool you can get with it, may I suggest you go visit: www.forbidden.co.uk , for Forbidden Technologies
and their products Clesh and Forscene (-I don't work for them).

They're also at Von07.

Their products have been available in beta and basic form for years+, and the full-bloodied stuff for a couple of years+ (-well before youtube, etc. developed).


Yours kindly,

Shakir Razak

What do you mean it doesn't support Google Maps? and Yahoo? One of the main buttons is Maps and it's Google Maps, the email is Push Tech and it's Yahoo. I'm I missing something?

Greg: the Radar mobile app will be available through various distribution partners, and is now downloadable for a limited time through the Radar WAP site.

Once you've created your account on the web, log into Radar (http://radar.net) from your phone's mobile browser. If your phone and carrier are supported, you'll see a "Download Software" link that will install the app over the air.

If you don't see a link, stay tuned. We're adding more devices all the time.

Enjoy.

@12. No. Actually Steve Jobs is dead wrong. He appears to believe that mobile phones are more like iPods than they are like personal computers; so it's OK for them to be *effectively* closed devices.

Now, imagine if Apple made it so that Macs were closed devices, such that "anyone" couldn't develop for them. They wouldn't sell as many as they do. And the truth is, mobile phones are rapidly becoming small personal computers. And that means, people will want to be free to install (and develop) apps on them, in the way they want. It's been pretty obvious this would happen for years; but they're really coming into their own now as the "computer power" of phones reaches the point where it's possible to develop really cool apps. And almost always, these apps are developed by using Java, because Java ships on 80% of cell phones.

Don't bet against Apple including Java with iPhones at some point. Steve Jobs happens to be wrong on this; but he's hardly an idiot. If enough Apple customers tell Apple they want Java on iPhone, that's what they'll get. And that might be sooner than many people think... The day of the iPhone announcement, Apple developer boards were swamped with Apple developers asking for Java on the iPhone. So much so that Apple had to ask people to stop posting on that topic because it was swamping the boards.

I saw a demo of radar last year and signed up, but haven't used it beyond posting a few test photos.

It seems a step back to a time when people thought you were only supposed to share photos with your friends and family.

But people want to be able to publish their photos for anyone to see.

And if there are photos you don't want everyone to see, there are privacy controls on flickr (and other sites).

It seems like radar should at least give people the option of making some or all of their photos public.

Thanks John. No download link for me. Treo 650 (ATT wireless/Cingular/ATTwireless)

Radar's cool. Even I would give a piece of my brain to Steve Jobs to feast upon, and I'm sure he would have a good apetite for it. Though I worship him :)

I gave it a try. Its like... Whatever... I'm using a Windows Moble device on Cingular. No download for me.

First off, "mobile 2.0" is long past us. Please visit Asia at your earliest convenience and have a local show you what they can do with their devices. (Japan, Korea especially)

Second, the "next web" is not about the device or the platform or the browser, it is about finally making all three able to - connect to the network as easily as possible, - connect as ubiquitously as possible and - access the same data/services regardless.

Yes making the mobile platform as open as possible is key. That tranlsates to having at least one platform available on-device that makes afordances for hackes and open-source weenies to play and make stuff. Nokia did this with Python on the N-series (and then promptly messed that up).

The only problem with Java is it never got picked up really by anyone but the corporate programmer crowd. DIY hackers prefer other environments/cultures.

It is very clear the iPhone is not in any way positioned for the tinkerers, but for the mass market who just wants something "polished and perfect", regardless if that means "closed, proprietary, controled" (and I make no moral judgement on that. there are benefits to being so.) And it is further clear that Apple is not interested in, or simply does not see, in allowing their market base to invest some of it's time to make their product really shine. Maybe tat will come later. "Get as many out in a first run, then open it up a bit once we've recouped development costs and not incurred too much support pain (which would happen if they ship something with little open doors that unwitting users could get snagged on)."

That said, the iPhone runs Mac OS X, which is BSD Unix, and it has a USB port. Someone will "get in", and quick too.

Anyways. I don't know how John feels about us saying so but yes, Radar is like Twitter for cameraphone pictures, and it is hugely powerful. Way more so than Twitter. (The only reason the technerds didn't pick up on Radar earlier is cause it has no API or feeds or other such stuff: it too is meant for a different market...)

Excuse me, but there are NO OPEN CELL PHONES on the market today.. so why should the iPhone be? Don't tell me there are! There aren't. Every one of them requires you to download and pay for apps through their exclusive service.. You can't just download them over a USB cable.. and you can't save them or retransmit them to a new phone when you upgrade. They force you to pay for them again. How is that open? Why should iPhone work any differently from the competitors? As usual, people have unusually high expectations of Apple.. so much so that they don't even reality check what exists today when they debate about how what Apple makes should be working tomorrow morning.. !

Xapplimatic: I suggest you research a bit more before you run at the mouth, because you evidently haven't the slightest clue. :)
There are tons of applications, written by everyday individuals, available for download and use on mobile devices (cellphone? what's that? something your grandma uses?). Some even for free. Yes most platforms are closed, and yes lots of the really cool stuff is somehow blocked off, be it at the hardware, platform or network layer, but they DO exist and ARE possible.

Anyone who knows how can write a J2ME app that can run on a wide range of devices. That's a fact which somehow escaped your thorough research apparently. ;)

Radar seems to be cool but do we need Java for it? Do Google Maps need Java on the iPhone? When Radar will become great we will get is on the iPhone but not programmed in Java.

Had a quick look at Radar. Not a 'killer app' for me as the whole social networking thing has passed me by.

I tell you what is for me: Gmail and Sky by Mobile. In the UK, I can access a Java app on my SE K800i, browse the whole Sky TV guide and get my Sky HD box to record stuff remotely. Sometimes I don't know how I live without it.

Hey Boris,
After re-reading Xapplimatic's comment for what you thought you read, I did not see anywhere he says they are not possible. He stated the iPhone is not going to be open and that other phones aren't either....

The truth is that Java on mobile is the only economical way of building applications for mobile phones that will work on a large number of different mobile phone devices on the market. It is phone's like the coming iPhone, Windows Mobile, Palm Treo and some very proprietary phones by Motorola, LG, Samsung and Sony that make up the 20% of the phone market that break the bank for application developers.

I am with Melodeo Mobilcast that is working to port podcasts to mobile phones all over the world and the missing support for java forces us to spend thousands of wasted dollars building device specific versions of our Mobilcast application.

The mobile industry just needs to make Java standard on all phones.

Mobilcast is available to be installed outside of most of the carrier networks with our Mobilcast v5 beta. http://mobilcast.com/mobile_center

The only carrier that will absolutly not run Mobilcast is Verizon here in the USA.

Boris said:

"And it is further clear that Apple is not interested in, or simply does not see, in allowing their market base to invest some of it’s time to make their product really shine."

And, I laughed. Why is it that every third rate programmer in the country thinks he can write better applications for the iPhone than Apple's inhouse developers and its partners can? I'll answer that. The A word -- arrogance. I, for one, do not consider arrogance a guarantee of ability. I suspect Steve Jobs doesn't either.

Rob, I think many early adopters awful experience with mobile Java on PDAs permanently alienated us. We are NOT crying copious tears over not having J2ME apps on our mobile phones.

No Java? Then no Gmail Mobile app. No Google Maps Mobile. No skype apps. No Opera Mini browser. None of the thousands and thousands of games like Darkest Fear.

Funny, reminds me of when Windows Mobile users where desperately scrounging around for a way to update the VM on their phones because they wanted to download Java apps.

Stevie, the iPhone is not going to fly yoo far as a CLOSED system in a highly competitive, open world.

Btw, what's even funnier is that a cousin of MIDP in the CDC profile, BD-Java, is going to be powering Pixar films like Cars in Blu-ray discs ;-)

http://www.blueboard.com/bluray/

I have to agree with asj. The closed system of the iPhone is going to keep it from competition with other "smart phones." I guess when their target audience is identical to the current iPod users, they just want an iPod with more features so it's not a "phone with a lot of features" but an "iPod with a lot of features."

http://nationwidevpn.com

The problem with Java as Apple sees it, is that it is an open cross platform technology with standardarized specifications and API’s. Java would hurt iPhone’s proprietary nature by making mobile applications portable to other mobile devices. The rest of the arguments are BS. MS and Apple will always fight technology that hurts the proprietary nature of their systems.

Steve Jobs, I believe wants to follow his philosophy of design. He doesnt want the apps looking like any other computer and mobile app, he wants his own, and why not refuse Java its everywhere and its appearance/performance aint the best. I dont trust Java, its performance is slow, and appearance seems like its the first gui os, i remember getting one of the first phones that supported java and thought, wow they downgraded.

I reckon its the best idea not including java, it forces something new to be done, or simply more secure closed programming, and hopefully no viruses and glitches.

Having open technology is a bad option and should be strictly for developers only. Why? might you ask.

I'll tell you why, actually no you can realise it.
Think of how many hours you've used (wasted) tring to make your computer better and looking for software?

If you say lots your obviosly a windows/linux user, like me.

I want to convert to mac but dont have the money. I realise I spend more time working then fixing(tweaking,adding,removing) on a mac

and with hardware being more expensive it forces you to conform and just get back to using time wisely.

and for all the one button mouse haters, just plug a normal mouse in it will work just like it did on any other PC. (so many people i know dont realise)

What can I do if I have an idea java-app for the iPhone? kostyai@mail.com

SUDHEER>B

mobile alerts on JAVA jobs

I agree, i think the software is great. I think the iphone is a great phone and it has voip also. http://t1stopshop.com