An evangelism opportunity…

When I worked at Microsoft I remembered lots of people in the evangelism group worried that Linux was taking over the startup world in Silicon Valley. Heck, I was one of those people who noted that almost every startup was using LAMP instead of Windows.

There are very few opportunities to change the decisions of a startup in terms of the infrastructure that has been chosen.

What are they?

1) When a startup first germinates. Why? Cause that’s when an entrepreneur decides between Linux, Sun, or Microsoft backends. And on databases. MySQL, SQL Server, Oracle, etc.
2) When a startup hits a major resource snag. IE, a major server dies and needs to be replaced.

I can’t think of another time when a startup could be switched from one ecosystem to another. Do you?

So, why am I telling you this? Because Zooomr is in the second group. I just got off the phone with Kristopher Tate and they are really in dire need of new database machines to get their servers back up.

If I were working at Microsoft or at Sun I’d be flying a team to Zooomr to help them get back up and running. I’d also videotape everything, and make a big deal about how a startup survived due to these efforts.

It’s interesting. Lots of companies claim to care about startups. Here’s a chance to help one. And, even, get one to switch from LAMP to Windows or something else. Anyone in?

302 thoughts on “An evangelism opportunity…

  1. shelley, it might be time for you to go away.

    i’ve agreed with many of your points, but it’s the attitude that i don’t get. i’m sorry you’re not on the A-list (just read your blog for the first time after scanning these comments); but hell, most of us aren’t even on the Z-list.

    i’m rooting for zooomr, b/c i think they *will* change the game. am i disappointed that after two failed launches they haven’t gotten any sysadmin help for kristopher? yes, but i also can’t really speak to it — the whole money where your mouth is thing.

  2. shelley, it might be time for you to go away.

    i’ve agreed with many of your points, but it’s the attitude that i don’t get. i’m sorry you’re not on the A-list (just read your blog for the first time after scanning these comments); but hell, most of us aren’t even on the Z-list.

    i’m rooting for zooomr, b/c i think they *will* change the game. am i disappointed that after two failed launches they haven’t gotten any sysadmin help for kristopher? yes, but i also can’t really speak to it — the whole money where your mouth is thing.

  3. shelley, it might be time for you to go away.

    i’ve agreed with many of your points, but it’s the attitude that i don’t get. i’m sorry you’re not on the A-list (just read your blog for the first time after scanning these comments); but hell, most of us aren’t even on the Z-list.

    i’m rooting for zooomr, b/c i think they *will* change the game. am i disappointed that after two failed launches they haven’t gotten any sysadmin help for kristopher? yes, but i also can’t really speak to it — the whole money where your mouth is thing.

  4. Just to give people a quick update, thanks to Robert’s support and efforts we were put in touch with Zoho this morning who have offered to help support Zooomr. Raj Vegesna has spent all afternoon with us getting us situated in Zoho’s data center with a new server. That’s where we are right now working to get Zooomr Mark III back up and running.

    I haven’t seen my kids or slept much in the last 48 hours but we will get Zooomr back up because we care about the Zooomr community.

    Additionally Sun Microsystems has stepped up and has a server being sent over on a truck as we speak to reinforce our efforts to get back online.

    A lot has been written here deriding our business efforts and plan so I’d like to take a minute to share that with you.

    At present the $2.5 billion stock photography market is dominated by three companies primarily. Getty, Corbis, and Jupitermedia. These companies accept very few photographers each year and are gatekeepers to a market that many, many more photographers should be involved with. Many of the best photographers that I know have been rejected by the likes of Getty and Corbis.

    If you do get accepted as a photographer there then you basically get paid 40% (I’m generalizing here) of the gross proceeds from the sale of your images.

    For everybody else in the world, the only way to access this market is to go through the microstock agencies online. These agencies might accept some of your work and they might not. In the case of the largest of these (iStockphoto, now owned by Getty) they will pay you 20% of the proceeds of sale. There they sell your images for $1, $3 or $5. So if you sell a $3 photograph you might get paid 60 cents.

    The average royalty free photograph at Getty by the way sells for about $285.

    What the internet is best at is at eliminating the middleman. eBay did this. Craigslist did this. Many, many other successful internet ventures have done this.

    What Zooomr wants to do is to open up this $2.5 billion market. You see the photos that I’m taking with my 5D. That my friend Lane Hartwell is taking with her 5D. That my friend Sam Bloomgberg-Rissman is shooting in Spain and Shanghai. These photographs are every bit as good as what the Pros at Getty and Corbis or shooting. And we are not alone. There are literally thousands of amazing photographers shooting out there right now. I know these people. They are my friends. I know their work. I favorite and comment on their images. And their images are every bit as good as the Pros.

    Zooomr wants to open the stock photography market but we also want to change the equation of how the $2.5 billion market is divided up. You see, from our perspective, why should great photographers like Jeff Clow get paid 20% for a $1 image on iStockphoto? Even the pros. Why should they only get 40%.

    What Zooomr wants to do is redefine the stock photography market and pay photographers 90%. Yes, 90% while letting them have complete pricing control over their images. Working photographers everywhere deserve to get the bulk of the money made on images that they create.

    And you know what else. Do you know what the sale of $100 image will mean to a kid in India or China? Do you know how much more that will mean to them than it does to you and I? By localizing in 18 languages (and growing rapidly) Zooomr will open up this economic pie to the entire world.

    And we think we can operate on a 10% cut. And if 10% is more than we need to get by we’ll change the equation to 95% to the photographer.

    We are not doing this to get rich. I took out a second mortgage on my house to make this work. We are doing this because we want to change the world of photo sharing. We are doing this because we passionate believe in photosharing and in online photosharing in all the forms it takes.

    Flickr is a great service. I’ve been preaching to the folks at Flickr that they should do stock photography since the first moment that I met them. But that’s not what Flickr is. Flickr is a non commercial service. Flickr will likely stay pretty much just as they are today for a long time. Innovating here and there, but not doing the exciting things that we want to do at Zooomr. Their next big feat will be to integrate about 2 bilion photos from Yahoo photos into Flickr.

    By the way, I wish everyone would stop the either/or comparisons with Flickr and Zooomr. Trust me. There is room for both. I guarantee you that many of our most passionate users on Zooomr *also* have Flickr accounts. I do. I love Flickr. Will I bitch at them when I think they are doing the wrong thing? You bet. But I love Flickr and the Flickr Community. And at the same time I love Zooomr and the Zooomr Community. They are two different things. Both good.

    Anyways. Zooomr will survive. Zooomr will survive because more than anything it is built on pure passion and love for photography and photosharing and community. And someday we will look back on these growing pains and remember that sometimes in order to do incredible things you must go through fire. We will go through fire but we will survive.

    When we launched yesterday it was glorious. For about 10 glorious minutes you should have seen it. Many of us were in a chat room together and celebrating. And then we stumbled. Hard.

    But you know what? There was a community there that picked us up and dusted us off and got us back on our feet. Robert Scoble. Zoho. Sun Microsystems. We got many more emails reaching out from other companies, even Microsoft. And we gotten dozens and dozens of emails from our community saying things like hey, I just donated $30. It’s all I can afford but I wanted to help out in the only way that I could.

    The Zooomr Community is strong. Shelly Powers spent 5 minutes in a chat room last night and has declared Zooomr unfit. But something great has been going on in that chat room all week long. Robert knows it. He’s been in the room with us not for 5 minutes but actually for many many hours. Dave Sifry’s stopped by. He sees what we are doing. Even the folks from Flickr have been by believe it or not. My favorite Flickr staffer Rev Dan Catt has even been hanging out with us. Our users have sent us food. One of our users drove Kristopher down to our data center last night at 1am in the morning. You tell me another company that has users this passionate.

    As I write this I’m sitting on a hard floor in Zoho’s space in Sunnyvale. Raj from Zoho is helping Kristopher get our servers back online at 8:30 at night in their space with their servers. This is what it’s all about.

    I will never forget the generousity of the community that helped fight for Zooomr this week. I love you all.

    Power to the people. The best photographs in the world have yet to be taken.

  5. Just to give people a quick update, thanks to Robert’s support and efforts we were put in touch with Zoho this morning who have offered to help support Zooomr. Raj Vegesna has spent all afternoon with us getting us situated in Zoho’s data center with a new server. That’s where we are right now working to get Zooomr Mark III back up and running.

    I haven’t seen my kids or slept much in the last 48 hours but we will get Zooomr back up because we care about the Zooomr community.

    Additionally Sun Microsystems has stepped up and has a server being sent over on a truck as we speak to reinforce our efforts to get back online.

    A lot has been written here deriding our business efforts and plan so I’d like to take a minute to share that with you.

    At present the $2.5 billion stock photography market is dominated by three companies primarily. Getty, Corbis, and Jupitermedia. These companies accept very few photographers each year and are gatekeepers to a market that many, many more photographers should be involved with. Many of the best photographers that I know have been rejected by the likes of Getty and Corbis.

    If you do get accepted as a photographer there then you basically get paid 40% (I’m generalizing here) of the gross proceeds from the sale of your images.

    For everybody else in the world, the only way to access this market is to go through the microstock agencies online. These agencies might accept some of your work and they might not. In the case of the largest of these (iStockphoto, now owned by Getty) they will pay you 20% of the proceeds of sale. There they sell your images for $1, $3 or $5. So if you sell a $3 photograph you might get paid 60 cents.

    The average royalty free photograph at Getty by the way sells for about $285.

    What the internet is best at is at eliminating the middleman. eBay did this. Craigslist did this. Many, many other successful internet ventures have done this.

    What Zooomr wants to do is to open up this $2.5 billion market. You see the photos that I’m taking with my 5D. That my friend Lane Hartwell is taking with her 5D. That my friend Sam Bloomgberg-Rissman is shooting in Spain and Shanghai. These photographs are every bit as good as what the Pros at Getty and Corbis or shooting. And we are not alone. There are literally thousands of amazing photographers shooting out there right now. I know these people. They are my friends. I know their work. I favorite and comment on their images. And their images are every bit as good as the Pros.

    Zooomr wants to open the stock photography market but we also want to change the equation of how the $2.5 billion market is divided up. You see, from our perspective, why should great photographers like Jeff Clow get paid 20% for a $1 image on iStockphoto? Even the pros. Why should they only get 40%.

    What Zooomr wants to do is redefine the stock photography market and pay photographers 90%. Yes, 90% while letting them have complete pricing control over their images. Working photographers everywhere deserve to get the bulk of the money made on images that they create.

    And you know what else. Do you know what the sale of $100 image will mean to a kid in India or China? Do you know how much more that will mean to them than it does to you and I? By localizing in 18 languages (and growing rapidly) Zooomr will open up this economic pie to the entire world.

    And we think we can operate on a 10% cut. And if 10% is more than we need to get by we’ll change the equation to 95% to the photographer.

    We are not doing this to get rich. I took out a second mortgage on my house to make this work. We are doing this because we want to change the world of photo sharing. We are doing this because we passionate believe in photosharing and in online photosharing in all the forms it takes.

    Flickr is a great service. I’ve been preaching to the folks at Flickr that they should do stock photography since the first moment that I met them. But that’s not what Flickr is. Flickr is a non commercial service. Flickr will likely stay pretty much just as they are today for a long time. Innovating here and there, but not doing the exciting things that we want to do at Zooomr. Their next big feat will be to integrate about 2 bilion photos from Yahoo photos into Flickr.

    By the way, I wish everyone would stop the either/or comparisons with Flickr and Zooomr. Trust me. There is room for both. I guarantee you that many of our most passionate users on Zooomr *also* have Flickr accounts. I do. I love Flickr. Will I bitch at them when I think they are doing the wrong thing? You bet. But I love Flickr and the Flickr Community. And at the same time I love Zooomr and the Zooomr Community. They are two different things. Both good.

    Anyways. Zooomr will survive. Zooomr will survive because more than anything it is built on pure passion and love for photography and photosharing and community. And someday we will look back on these growing pains and remember that sometimes in order to do incredible things you must go through fire. We will go through fire but we will survive.

    When we launched yesterday it was glorious. For about 10 glorious minutes you should have seen it. Many of us were in a chat room together and celebrating. And then we stumbled. Hard.

    But you know what? There was a community there that picked us up and dusted us off and got us back on our feet. Robert Scoble. Zoho. Sun Microsystems. We got many more emails reaching out from other companies, even Microsoft. And we gotten dozens and dozens of emails from our community saying things like hey, I just donated $30. It’s all I can afford but I wanted to help out in the only way that I could.

    The Zooomr Community is strong. Shelly Powers spent 5 minutes in a chat room last night and has declared Zooomr unfit. But something great has been going on in that chat room all week long. Robert knows it. He’s been in the room with us not for 5 minutes but actually for many many hours. Dave Sifry’s stopped by. He sees what we are doing. Even the folks from Flickr have been by believe it or not. My favorite Flickr staffer Rev Dan Catt has even been hanging out with us. Our users have sent us food. One of our users drove Kristopher down to our data center last night at 1am in the morning. You tell me another company that has users this passionate.

    As I write this I’m sitting on a hard floor in Zoho’s space in Sunnyvale. Raj from Zoho is helping Kristopher get our servers back online at 8:30 at night in their space with their servers. This is what it’s all about.

    I will never forget the generousity of the community that helped fight for Zooomr this week. I love you all.

    Power to the people. The best photographs in the world have yet to be taken.

  6. Just to give people a quick update, thanks to Robert’s support and efforts we were put in touch with Zoho this morning who have offered to help support Zooomr. Raj Vegesna has spent all afternoon with us getting us situated in Zoho’s data center with a new server. That’s where we are right now working to get Zooomr Mark III back up and running.

    I haven’t seen my kids or slept much in the last 48 hours but we will get Zooomr back up because we care about the Zooomr community.

    Additionally Sun Microsystems has stepped up and has a server being sent over on a truck as we speak to reinforce our efforts to get back online.

    A lot has been written here deriding our business efforts and plan so I’d like to take a minute to share that with you.

    At present the $2.5 billion stock photography market is dominated by three companies primarily. Getty, Corbis, and Jupitermedia. These companies accept very few photographers each year and are gatekeepers to a market that many, many more photographers should be involved with. Many of the best photographers that I know have been rejected by the likes of Getty and Corbis.

    If you do get accepted as a photographer there then you basically get paid 40% (I’m generalizing here) of the gross proceeds from the sale of your images.

    For everybody else in the world, the only way to access this market is to go through the microstock agencies online. These agencies might accept some of your work and they might not. In the case of the largest of these (iStockphoto, now owned by Getty) they will pay you 20% of the proceeds of sale. There they sell your images for $1, $3 or $5. So if you sell a $3 photograph you might get paid 60 cents.

    The average royalty free photograph at Getty by the way sells for about $285.

    What the internet is best at is at eliminating the middleman. eBay did this. Craigslist did this. Many, many other successful internet ventures have done this.

    What Zooomr wants to do is to open up this $2.5 billion market. You see the photos that I’m taking with my 5D. That my friend Lane Hartwell is taking with her 5D. That my friend Sam Bloomgberg-Rissman is shooting in Spain and Shanghai. These photographs are every bit as good as what the Pros at Getty and Corbis or shooting. And we are not alone. There are literally thousands of amazing photographers shooting out there right now. I know these people. They are my friends. I know their work. I favorite and comment on their images. And their images are every bit as good as the Pros.

    Zooomr wants to open the stock photography market but we also want to change the equation of how the $2.5 billion market is divided up. You see, from our perspective, why should great photographers like Jeff Clow get paid 20% for a $1 image on iStockphoto? Even the pros. Why should they only get 40%.

    What Zooomr wants to do is redefine the stock photography market and pay photographers 90%. Yes, 90% while letting them have complete pricing control over their images. Working photographers everywhere deserve to get the bulk of the money made on images that they create.

    And you know what else. Do you know what the sale of $100 image will mean to a kid in India or China? Do you know how much more that will mean to them than it does to you and I? By localizing in 18 languages (and growing rapidly) Zooomr will open up this economic pie to the entire world.

    And we think we can operate on a 10% cut. And if 10% is more than we need to get by we’ll change the equation to 95% to the photographer.

    We are not doing this to get rich. I took out a second mortgage on my house to make this work. We are doing this because we want to change the world of photo sharing. We are doing this because we passionate believe in photosharing and in online photosharing in all the forms it takes.

    Flickr is a great service. I’ve been preaching to the folks at Flickr that they should do stock photography since the first moment that I met them. But that’s not what Flickr is. Flickr is a non commercial service. Flickr will likely stay pretty much just as they are today for a long time. Innovating here and there, but not doing the exciting things that we want to do at Zooomr. Their next big feat will be to integrate about 2 bilion photos from Yahoo photos into Flickr.

    By the way, I wish everyone would stop the either/or comparisons with Flickr and Zooomr. Trust me. There is room for both. I guarantee you that many of our most passionate users on Zooomr *also* have Flickr accounts. I do. I love Flickr. Will I bitch at them when I think they are doing the wrong thing? You bet. But I love Flickr and the Flickr Community. And at the same time I love Zooomr and the Zooomr Community. They are two different things. Both good.

    Anyways. Zooomr will survive. Zooomr will survive because more than anything it is built on pure passion and love for photography and photosharing and community. And someday we will look back on these growing pains and remember that sometimes in order to do incredible things you must go through fire. We will go through fire but we will survive.

    When we launched yesterday it was glorious. For about 10 glorious minutes you should have seen it. Many of us were in a chat room together and celebrating. And then we stumbled. Hard.

    But you know what? There was a community there that picked us up and dusted us off and got us back on our feet. Robert Scoble. Zoho. Sun Microsystems. We got many more emails reaching out from other companies, even Microsoft. And we gotten dozens and dozens of emails from our community saying things like hey, I just donated $30. It’s all I can afford but I wanted to help out in the only way that I could.

    The Zooomr Community is strong. Shelly Powers spent 5 minutes in a chat room last night and has declared Zooomr unfit. But something great has been going on in that chat room all week long. Robert knows it. He’s been in the room with us not for 5 minutes but actually for many many hours. Dave Sifry’s stopped by. He sees what we are doing. Even the folks from Flickr have been by believe it or not. My favorite Flickr staffer Rev Dan Catt has even been hanging out with us. Our users have sent us food. One of our users drove Kristopher down to our data center last night at 1am in the morning. You tell me another company that has users this passionate.

    As I write this I’m sitting on a hard floor in Zoho’s space in Sunnyvale. Raj from Zoho is helping Kristopher get our servers back online at 8:30 at night in their space with their servers. This is what it’s all about.

    I will never forget the generousity of the community that helped fight for Zooomr this week. I love you all.

    Power to the people. The best photographs in the world have yet to be taken.

  7. I just read through the last two-thirds of comments to see if anyone was actually fool enough to lay thousands or millions of greenbacks on Zooomr (awful name). It appears, that cheerleading and Robert’s ‘help my friends because they are my friends’ appeal notwithstanding, no one has. That proves that even the people on this thread telling the Zoomies what they want to hear have common sense.

    Keep fighting the good fight, Shelley. A lot of people criticizing you are being influenced to use their heads whether they like it or not.

    Robert keeps bragging about the scale of Kristopher’s sort of plans. Seems to me that the real issue might be that Kristopher needs to scale those dubious plans back. If Asia is his core region, maybe he should serve Asian markets first, rolling out from Korea or Japan.

  8. I just read through the last two-thirds of comments to see if anyone was actually fool enough to lay thousands or millions of greenbacks on Zooomr (awful name). It appears, that cheerleading and Robert’s ‘help my friends because they are my friends’ appeal notwithstanding, no one has. That proves that even the people on this thread telling the Zoomies what they want to hear have common sense.

    Keep fighting the good fight, Shelley. A lot of people criticizing you are being influenced to use their heads whether they like it or not.

    Robert keeps bragging about the scale of Kristopher’s sort of plans. Seems to me that the real issue might be that Kristopher needs to scale those dubious plans back. If Asia is his core region, maybe he should serve Asian markets first, rolling out from Korea or Japan.

  9. I just read through the last two-thirds of comments to see if anyone was actually fool enough to lay thousands or millions of greenbacks on Zooomr (awful name). It appears, that cheerleading and Robert’s ‘help my friends because they are my friends’ appeal notwithstanding, no one has. That proves that even the people on this thread telling the Zoomies what they want to hear have common sense.

    Keep fighting the good fight, Shelley. A lot of people criticizing you are being influenced to use their heads whether they like it or not.

    Robert keeps bragging about the scale of Kristopher’s sort of plans. Seems to me that the real issue might be that Kristopher needs to scale those dubious plans back. If Asia is his core region, maybe he should serve Asian markets first, rolling out from Korea or Japan.

  10. > I forgot about Flickr’s “pro” accounts. But if that’s really returning a huge return on investment I’d be very surprised.

    Do you even use Flickr? The site has ads as well. I’m pretty sure Yahoo! wouldn’t have shut down a large, profitable service like Yahoo! Photos to replace it with an unprofitable Flickr.

    Seriously, sometimes you need to pause and reflect before spewing on these threads. I doubt the Flickr folks appreciate your questionable conclusions about their business in your attempt to make Zooomr look good.

  11. > I forgot about Flickr’s “pro” accounts. But if that’s really returning a huge return on investment I’d be very surprised.

    Do you even use Flickr? The site has ads as well. I’m pretty sure Yahoo! wouldn’t have shut down a large, profitable service like Yahoo! Photos to replace it with an unprofitable Flickr.

    Seriously, sometimes you need to pause and reflect before spewing on these threads. I doubt the Flickr folks appreciate your questionable conclusions about their business in your attempt to make Zooomr look good.

  12. > I forgot about Flickr’s “pro” accounts. But if that’s really returning a huge return on investment I’d be very surprised.

    Do you even use Flickr? The site has ads as well. I’m pretty sure Yahoo! wouldn’t have shut down a large, profitable service like Yahoo! Photos to replace it with an unprofitable Flickr.

    Seriously, sometimes you need to pause and reflect before spewing on these threads. I doubt the Flickr folks appreciate your questionable conclusions about their business in your attempt to make Zooomr look good.

  13. I’m going come at this from a different angle. Much of the discussion above concerns technology and concerns business planning. These have their place and are important however what is important to me is having access to others who will comment upon, who will encourage me and who I can learn from. This is what community is about. I have not found these to be as readily available on any other photography sites as on Zooomr. This is down to the community that Kris and Thomas have built and their attitudes and behaviour towards that community.

    I have worked in community development and it is within these areas that Zooomr has demonstrated many of its strengths.

    It is not exclusive in fact has gone to considerable lengths to include people from outside the West. But more fundementally people like Thomas and other experienced members (Raoul for example)go out of their way to look at and comment on other peoples pictures and not just the people they know. This has enabled newbies and technophobes like me to feel more comfortable able to post our thoughts and to get involved. Too often on the internet many of us are excluded by the language, by attitudes, by our own self doubt.

    Zooomr is open Im not talking about code but letting the members know what is going on. The video this last week has been about this. They have tried to keep people informed and the community has gradually developed its own ways of doing this better. People have at times been critical but there has not been a huge outpouring of blaming but rather of understanding and support. This is so refreshing these days when people seem to find it easy to say the negative rather then the positive.

    I think this week I have seen a community develop flourish and hopefully the new Zooomr will blooom sooon. And hey yep I’ve made a small donation and feel good about it.

  14. I’m going come at this from a different angle. Much of the discussion above concerns technology and concerns business planning. These have their place and are important however what is important to me is having access to others who will comment upon, who will encourage me and who I can learn from. This is what community is about. I have not found these to be as readily available on any other photography sites as on Zooomr. This is down to the community that Kris and Thomas have built and their attitudes and behaviour towards that community.

    I have worked in community development and it is within these areas that Zooomr has demonstrated many of its strengths.

    It is not exclusive in fact has gone to considerable lengths to include people from outside the West. But more fundementally people like Thomas and other experienced members (Raoul for example)go out of their way to look at and comment on other peoples pictures and not just the people they know. This has enabled newbies and technophobes like me to feel more comfortable able to post our thoughts and to get involved. Too often on the internet many of us are excluded by the language, by attitudes, by our own self doubt.

    Zooomr is open Im not talking about code but letting the members know what is going on. The video this last week has been about this. They have tried to keep people informed and the community has gradually developed its own ways of doing this better. People have at times been critical but there has not been a huge outpouring of blaming but rather of understanding and support. This is so refreshing these days when people seem to find it easy to say the negative rather then the positive.

    I think this week I have seen a community develop flourish and hopefully the new Zooomr will blooom sooon. And hey yep I’ve made a small donation and feel good about it.

  15. I say keep the ice out wine, and the tomato juice out of beer :)

    This is from a year ago, so they did not learn much since last time:

    http://burningbird.net/stuff/how-to-roll-out-a-web-20-product/

    I also don’t understand how Ron Conway got his $50,000 back without telling Thomas or Kris. However it happened, to have a guy like Ron Conway take his money back without asking after less than a year is not a good sign.

    Businesses don’t ask for donations, charities do.

  16. I say keep the ice out wine, and the tomato juice out of beer :)

    This is from a year ago, so they did not learn much since last time:

    http://burningbird.net/stuff/how-to-roll-out-a-web-20-product/

    I also don’t understand how Ron Conway got his $50,000 back without telling Thomas or Kris. However it happened, to have a guy like Ron Conway take his money back without asking after less than a year is not a good sign.

    Businesses don’t ask for donations, charities do.

  17. I’m not going to raise pom-poms but I think Thomas Hawk has some valid points. Unless you’re a long-time member of a community, it’s hard to see the highs and lows that go along with it. I’ve been at Flickr nearly as long as Thomas and at Zooomr for quite a while now, as well. I’ve seen members up in arms over Flickr downtimes and still be supportive.

    Shelley keeps talking about transparency and telling us what is going on. Thomas and Kris have done that. Sure, they’ve had a beer or wine or we’ve seen them eat dinner — but the truth of the matter is that they have been honest from the beginning. They had high hopes for something that is really good and will be a positive addition to the photo community. If there was a wall to hit, they hit each one and yet still got up and kept moving. I think the pom-poms helped in that. When you don’t have community support, it’s hard to keep going.

    I can’t imagine any of the users not having backups of their photos elsewhere. I don’t use Flickr, Zooomr, or even my own photoblog as the main storage of my photos. That’s supplemental. In fact, many of us discussed this very topic on the chat boards last night and everyone who chimed in had external storage (DVD, hard drives, etc). We’re not really losing our product.

    What we’ve gained, though, is a stronger community. People have rallied and made donations. We are behind Kristopher and Thomas because we like their vision. Maybe it was a lot harder to attain than they first thought but the vision is a good one — and it’s one that doesn’t just benefit them. They are looking out for us. So we look out for them, as well.

    There aren’t many online enterprises that say or do the same thing.

  18. I’m not going to raise pom-poms but I think Thomas Hawk has some valid points. Unless you’re a long-time member of a community, it’s hard to see the highs and lows that go along with it. I’ve been at Flickr nearly as long as Thomas and at Zooomr for quite a while now, as well. I’ve seen members up in arms over Flickr downtimes and still be supportive.

    Shelley keeps talking about transparency and telling us what is going on. Thomas and Kris have done that. Sure, they’ve had a beer or wine or we’ve seen them eat dinner — but the truth of the matter is that they have been honest from the beginning. They had high hopes for something that is really good and will be a positive addition to the photo community. If there was a wall to hit, they hit each one and yet still got up and kept moving. I think the pom-poms helped in that. When you don’t have community support, it’s hard to keep going.

    I can’t imagine any of the users not having backups of their photos elsewhere. I don’t use Flickr, Zooomr, or even my own photoblog as the main storage of my photos. That’s supplemental. In fact, many of us discussed this very topic on the chat boards last night and everyone who chimed in had external storage (DVD, hard drives, etc). We’re not really losing our product.

    What we’ve gained, though, is a stronger community. People have rallied and made donations. We are behind Kristopher and Thomas because we like their vision. Maybe it was a lot harder to attain than they first thought but the vision is a good one — and it’s one that doesn’t just benefit them. They are looking out for us. So we look out for them, as well.

    There aren’t many online enterprises that say or do the same thing.

  19. I’m not going to raise pom-poms but I think Thomas Hawk has some valid points. Unless you’re a long-time member of a community, it’s hard to see the highs and lows that go along with it. I’ve been at Flickr nearly as long as Thomas and at Zooomr for quite a while now, as well. I’ve seen members up in arms over Flickr downtimes and still be supportive.

    Shelley keeps talking about transparency and telling us what is going on. Thomas and Kris have done that. Sure, they’ve had a beer or wine or we’ve seen them eat dinner — but the truth of the matter is that they have been honest from the beginning. They had high hopes for something that is really good and will be a positive addition to the photo community. If there was a wall to hit, they hit each one and yet still got up and kept moving. I think the pom-poms helped in that. When you don’t have community support, it’s hard to keep going.

    I can’t imagine any of the users not having backups of their photos elsewhere. I don’t use Flickr, Zooomr, or even my own photoblog as the main storage of my photos. That’s supplemental. In fact, many of us discussed this very topic on the chat boards last night and everyone who chimed in had external storage (DVD, hard drives, etc). We’re not really losing our product.

    What we’ve gained, though, is a stronger community. People have rallied and made donations. We are behind Kristopher and Thomas because we like their vision. Maybe it was a lot harder to attain than they first thought but the vision is a good one — and it’s one that doesn’t just benefit them. They are looking out for us. So we look out for them, as well.

    There aren’t many online enterprises that say or do the same thing.

  20. Actually, if we’re going to be picky about facts, Flickr’s Pro Accounts are $25/year. They’re a bargain for sure.

  21. Seshadri: I’m in contact with them and their server problems might be solved WITHOUT getting funding. So, they are definitely working on “Plan B.” Funding just would make the solution simpler and more sustainable long term (they still need a good database administrator etc).

  22. Seshadri: I’m in contact with them and their server problems might be solved WITHOUT getting funding. So, they are definitely working on “Plan B.” Funding just would make the solution simpler and more sustainable long term (they still need a good database administrator etc).

  23. Seshadri: I’m in contact with them and their server problems might be solved WITHOUT getting funding. So, they are definitely working on “Plan B.” Funding just would make the solution simpler and more sustainable long term (they still need a good database administrator etc).

  24. “if you’ve been following Zooomr over the past week you’ll see that this situation is far past a “plan B.” ”

    yes. I haven’t been following too closely. But i still don’t think my plan-b question has been addressed.

    So are you saying even *if* they suddenly somehow get a huge amount of money *now* their problems will not be solved?
    if you don’t answer ‘yes’ then i am correct in assuming that they didn’t have a plan-b about the funding.

    BTW, i am not a zooomr user. I visited their website – nowhere it mentions about the outage???

  25. I’m with Shelley on this one. Rather than worrying about whether a tech company should donate a hardware or software solution, perhaps the call should go out for someone to donate a solid and sustainable business model instead…

  26. I’m with Shelley on this one. Rather than worrying about whether a tech company should donate a hardware or software solution, perhaps the call should go out for someone to donate a solid and sustainable business model instead…

  27. I’m with Shelley on this one. Rather than worrying about whether a tech company should donate a hardware or software solution, perhaps the call should go out for someone to donate a solid and sustainable business model instead…

  28. “if you’ve been following Zooomr over the past week you’ll see that this situation is far past a “plan B.” ”

    yes. I haven’t been following too closely. But i still don’t think my plan-b question has been addressed.

    So are you saying even *if* they suddenly somehow get a huge amount of money *now* their problems will not be solved?
    if you don’t answer ‘yes’ then i am correct in assuming that they didn’t have a plan-b about the funding.

    BTW, i am not a zooomr user. I visited their website – nowhere it mentions about the outage???

  29. “if you’ve been following Zooomr over the past week you’ll see that this situation is far past a “plan B.” ”

    yes. I haven’t been following too closely. But i still don’t think my plan-b question has been addressed.

    So are you saying even *if* they suddenly somehow get a huge amount of money *now* their problems will not be solved?
    if you don’t answer ‘yes’ then i am correct in assuming that they didn’t have a plan-b about the funding.

    BTW, i am not a zooomr user. I visited their website – nowhere it mentions about the outage???

  30. @96,

    That’s the problem with not doing fact checking and speculative journalism.

    “Heck, Flickr STILL doesn’t have a business model and that’s two years after Yahoo purchased it. Think about that one for a minute.”

    Had this been posted in a newspaper or magazine of any size, Flickr would have a serious legal complaint and rightly so. That’s an opinion, but it’s Scoble’s website so it changes the context of the comment. Glad he made the correction.

  31. @96,

    That’s the problem with not doing fact checking and speculative journalism.

    “Heck, Flickr STILL doesn’t have a business model and that’s two years after Yahoo purchased it. Think about that one for a minute.”

    Had this been posted in a newspaper or magazine of any size, Flickr would have a serious legal complaint and rightly so. That’s an opinion, but it’s Scoble’s website so it changes the context of the comment. Glad he made the correction.

  32. @96,

    That’s the problem with not doing fact checking and speculative journalism.

    “Heck, Flickr STILL doesn’t have a business model and that’s two years after Yahoo purchased it. Think about that one for a minute.”

    Had this been posted in a newspaper or magazine of any size, Flickr would have a serious legal complaint and rightly so. That’s an opinion, but it’s Scoble’s website so it changes the context of the comment. Glad he made the correction.

  33. Eric: fair enough. I forgot about Flickr’s “pro” accounts. But if that’s really returning a huge return on investment I’d be very surprised.

  34. Eric: fair enough. I forgot about Flickr’s “pro” accounts. But if that’s really returning a huge return on investment I’d be very surprised.

  35. Eric: fair enough. I forgot about Flickr’s “pro” accounts. But if that’s really returning a huge return on investment I’d be very surprised.

  36. Seshadri: if you’ve been following Zooomr over the past week you’ll see that this situation is far past a “plan B.” Nearly everything that could go wrong has gone wrong.

    You can’t always plan for every problem, especially when you don’t have the resources.

    They are continuing to work the problem, though, and I’ll let you know when the situation changes.

  37. Scoble says: “Heck, Flickr STILL doesn’t have a business model and that’s two years after Yahoo purchased it. Think about that one for a minute.”

    Thinking…

    OK, got it! Scoble does not know what he is talking about!

  38. Seshadri: if you’ve been following Zooomr over the past week you’ll see that this situation is far past a “plan B.” Nearly everything that could go wrong has gone wrong.

    You can’t always plan for every problem, especially when you don’t have the resources.

    They are continuing to work the problem, though, and I’ll let you know when the situation changes.

  39. Seshadri: if you’ve been following Zooomr over the past week you’ll see that this situation is far past a “plan B.” Nearly everything that could go wrong has gone wrong.

    You can’t always plan for every problem, especially when you don’t have the resources.

    They are continuing to work the problem, though, and I’ll let you know when the situation changes.

Comments are closed.