Comments

  1. Oh – and I should note – MySQL isn’t an option. Not bashing it, use it often, use it every day, love it. But it just isn’t what I need for this application.

    What I need for this application is to buy the right flavor of MS SQL :)

    Rob

  2. Oh – and I should note – MySQL isn’t an option. Not bashing it, use it often, use it every day, love it. But it just isn’t what I need for this application.

    What I need for this application is to buy the right flavor of MS SQL :)

    Rob

  3. Oh please. Some obscure evangelist in a district in the sales field force puts his number on his blog and that’s newsworthy. Not to mention that given his scope in the org he has no ability to impact much of anything. Yaaaawwwwwnnnnn.

  4. Oh please. Some obscure evangelist in a district in the sales field force puts his number on his blog and that’s newsworthy. Not to mention that given his scope in the org he has no ability to impact much of anything. Yaaaawwwwwnnnnn.

  5. @5 buy Enterprise. Then you’ll have access to some of the cool features that are in it as well as upgrade rights to other features to come and add on features and products that use Enterprise.

    But seriously you don’t need an evangelist for that. I know that MSFT marketing sucks and the feature list can be tough to decipher, but even at a high level you’ve got to be able to figure it out for your needs.

  6. @5 buy Enterprise. Then you’ll have access to some of the cool features that are in it as well as upgrade rights to other features to come and add on features and products that use Enterprise.

    But seriously you don’t need an evangelist for that. I know that MSFT marketing sucks and the feature list can be tough to decipher, but even at a high level you’ve got to be able to figure it out for your needs.

  7. @DPE – are you actually reading my comments? I said, “I’m in a startup” – just “buying the most expensive” is completely moronic advice. My goal it to build a business – if I had the resources to buy a successful one I might do that instead. You don’t build a business by spending willy-nilly.

    You work for the governement (or a phone company — or my ISP)?

    You obviously don’t work for a startup and never have (at least not a successful one!)

    Someone with some knowledge, please help. I just “flipped the boxo bit” on DPE. “Here’s your sign”

  8. @DPE – are you actually reading my comments? I said, “I’m in a startup” – just “buying the most expensive” is completely moronic advice. My goal it to build a business – if I had the resources to buy a successful one I might do that instead. You don’t build a business by spending willy-nilly.

    You work for the governement (or a phone company — or my ISP)?

    You obviously don’t work for a startup and never have (at least not a successful one!)

    Someone with some knowledge, please help. I just “flipped the boxo bit” on DPE. “Here’s your sign”

  9. @7 so buy standard, but really you can’t go below that. Honestly even your blog doesn’t give enough information to know. If I were a consultant I would love you, you have no idea what you want, a billing dream. You’ve got to look at features, load, scale and then potential growth in the next year (?) to find out what you want. I see none of that from what you provide. So honestly, buy whatever you want, standard will fit your need right now, enterprise now and later, standard maybe later, but depends on your architecture and need. I fear for your startup if you can’t articulate that. I’ve successfully helped lots of start ups and most of them have a better idea about what they need than you, plus much more experience deciphering a vendor stat sheet.

  10. @7 so buy standard, but really you can’t go below that. Honestly even your blog doesn’t give enough information to know. If I were a consultant I would love you, you have no idea what you want, a billing dream. You’ve got to look at features, load, scale and then potential growth in the next year (?) to find out what you want. I see none of that from what you provide. So honestly, buy whatever you want, standard will fit your need right now, enterprise now and later, standard maybe later, but depends on your architecture and need. I fear for your startup if you can’t articulate that. I’ve successfully helped lots of start ups and most of them have a better idea about what they need than you, plus much more experience deciphering a vendor stat sheet.

  11. @DPE – if you were a consultant for SQL (IE, Sales Rep) I WOULD NOT BE TALKING TO YOU.

    If I wanted to talk to a Sales Rep, I would call MS an thier 1-800 number.

    As for being your “patsy” – again, you are completely wrong – because I would not buy from you because you aren’t trying to HELP ME, you are trying to SELL ME.

    You start with the highest price. I resits – you drop your price.

    I am not buying a five year old car here – I am building a business. I won’t deal with snakes.

    And as for my blog – it’s a PERSONAL blog – where I write about stuff I wanna write about. It isn’t a corporate blog, and it has nothing to do with the company I am helping build. So yeah – I understand you wouldn’t learn much from it about what my specific needs for an un-announced startup might be.

  12. @DPE – if you were a consultant for SQL (IE, Sales Rep) I WOULD NOT BE TALKING TO YOU.

    If I wanted to talk to a Sales Rep, I would call MS an thier 1-800 number.

    As for being your “patsy” – again, you are completely wrong – because I would not buy from you because you aren’t trying to HELP ME, you are trying to SELL ME.

    You start with the highest price. I resits – you drop your price.

    I am not buying a five year old car here – I am building a business. I won’t deal with snakes.

    And as for my blog – it’s a PERSONAL blog – where I write about stuff I wanna write about. It isn’t a corporate blog, and it has nothing to do with the company I am helping build. So yeah – I understand you wouldn’t learn much from it about what my specific needs for an un-announced startup might be.

  13. @10 yeah, so why are you asking for help in this way. Seems like either a bait/troll or completely stupid.

    The post was about some evangelist deep buried in the MSFT org posting his number… You think that a field sales evangelist isn’t going to try to sell you? You don’t MSFT all that well.

  14. @10 yeah, so why are you asking for help in this way. Seems like either a bait/troll or completely stupid.

    The post was about some evangelist deep buried in the MSFT org posting his number… You think that a field sales evangelist isn’t going to try to sell you? You don’t MSFT all that well.

  15. Hey I want MSFT to be more relax on their policy or rule on speaking engagement.

    Can MSFT be more flexible? use more imagination in working with web group like ours that is full of creativities. Can MSFT hear me?

    Here’s a song “Relax, Take It Easy”

  16. Hey I want MSFT to be more relax on their policy or rule on speaking engagement.

    Can MSFT be more flexible? use more imagination in working with web group like ours that is full of creativities. Can MSFT hear me?

    Here’s a song “Relax, Take It Easy”

  17. @12…the answer is yes. MSFT has no really hard fast rules against speaking engagements. Sort of up to the employee/manager. But in the past, I have been able to speak pretty much anywhere/anytime there was even the slightest business justification….Hawaii, Turkey, Kansas…you name it.

  18. @12…the answer is yes. MSFT has no really hard fast rules against speaking engagements. Sort of up to the employee/manager. But in the past, I have been able to speak pretty much anywhere/anytime there was even the slightest business justification….Hawaii, Turkey, Kansas…you name it.

  19. @4/DPE Sucks -

    Ouch…

    > “force puts his number”?

    Please. Hardly, my friend. Apart from the 3 other DPE guys who held guns to my head and one of them told me about how my grandmother’s assets had mysteriously disappeared, I was not forced, like, at all. Honest.

    > Not to mention that given his scope in the org he
    > has no ability to impact much of anything.

    Man, you sound bitter. I’m gonna go off on tangent, but I do hope you take the time to read this, because from your text it sounds like you’re a ‘softie who’s just bitter about working here. Way before I’d joined MS, I was working for a giant software company here in the valley as a developer. I remember reading this post by Joel Spolsky called “Two Stories” – http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/TwoStories.html.

    When I was made the offer to come to MS, I was concerned about being a ‘nobody’ and not being able to make a difference. But reading Joel’s article made me believe. Specifically, where he says : “For one, it makes everyone that much more conscientious about their jobs. … All management did was hire smart people and gave them something to do. For another, it makes for an extremely nice place to work. Who doesn’t want to be king of their own domain? … This is probably THE reason why software people love working at Microsoft.” So, I spoke to a few other guys who worked at MS, all Purdue grads, all go-getters, just all around super-stars, all making a difference. So, here I was, starry eyed geek (the alpha-believer), thinking I could make a difference, and I took the plunge to work here. It’s been about 2.5 years, and I still believe. I know that if I try to do the right thing by the customer, MS and my management will back me up. I have that confidence. It’s happened before, it’ll likely happen again.

    ta,

    ai
    PS: We’re hiring, if you’re looking for a new job?

  20. @4/DPE Sucks -

    Ouch…

    > “force puts his number”?

    Please. Hardly, my friend. Apart from the 3 other DPE guys who held guns to my head and one of them told me about how my grandmother’s assets had mysteriously disappeared, I was not forced, like, at all. Honest.

    > Not to mention that given his scope in the org he
    > has no ability to impact much of anything.

    Man, you sound bitter. I’m gonna go off on tangent, but I do hope you take the time to read this, because from your text it sounds like you’re a ‘softie who’s just bitter about working here. Way before I’d joined MS, I was working for a giant software company here in the valley as a developer. I remember reading this post by Joel Spolsky called “Two Stories” – http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/TwoStories.html.

    When I was made the offer to come to MS, I was concerned about being a ‘nobody’ and not being able to make a difference. But reading Joel’s article made me believe. Specifically, where he says : “For one, it makes everyone that much more conscientious about their jobs. … All management did was hire smart people and gave them something to do. For another, it makes for an extremely nice place to work. Who doesn’t want to be king of their own domain? … This is probably THE reason why software people love working at Microsoft.” So, I spoke to a few other guys who worked at MS, all Purdue grads, all go-getters, just all around super-stars, all making a difference. So, here I was, starry eyed geek (the alpha-believer), thinking I could make a difference, and I took the plunge to work here. It’s been about 2.5 years, and I still believe. I know that if I try to do the right thing by the customer, MS and my management will back me up. I have that confidence. It’s happened before, it’ll likely happen again.

    ta,

    ai
    PS: We’re hiring, if you’re looking for a new job?

  21. @15…

    I appreciate your passion. I had it at one point. You can think that you’re making a difference, and perhaps your changing perceptions for the short term. But honestly, MSFT ships products, not perceptions. And if you don’t have any DCRs in PS, then you don’t have any impact. And if you do, then how many do you have approved. How many times have you received a green light from a PUM/GPM on a product feature request. That’s where it all stems from. If not, you’re holding the line short term, we appreciate that, keep up the good work, but admit that longer term, the ineffectiveness will set in.

  22. @15…

    I appreciate your passion. I had it at one point. You can think that you’re making a difference, and perhaps your changing perceptions for the short term. But honestly, MSFT ships products, not perceptions. And if you don’t have any DCRs in PS, then you don’t have any impact. And if you do, then how many do you have approved. How many times have you received a green light from a PUM/GPM on a product feature request. That’s where it all stems from. If not, you’re holding the line short term, we appreciate that, keep up the good work, but admit that longer term, the ineffectiveness will set in.

  23. @Phil/13

    > Didn’t Sun and Zoho help out Zooomr in the end?

    They did, yes. I was just throwing my number out there for anyone potentially in need of help from us in the future.

    ai

  24. @Phil/13

    > Didn’t Sun and Zoho help out Zooomr in the end?

    They did, yes. I was just throwing my number out there for anyone potentially in need of help from us in the future.

    ai

  25. Well, I guess that was the good MS. But the evil one is coming back again as well, just have a look at http://weblogs.asp.net/nunitaddin/ and see what they are doing to the developer of one of the most popular dev tools. Crazy, crazy, crazy. There you have a discussion already going on whether alpha programmers are leaving the MS platform (google for Fowler’s latest blog, or Sam Gentile) and then they engage in crap like that. Hard to believe, but apparently true. Even if they are legally right (which I don’t actually think, these EULA’s have a very dubios status in some countries), this is just terrible business behavior, i.e. essentially only a monopolist can act like that.

  26. Well, I guess that was the good MS. But the evil one is coming back again as well, just have a look at http://weblogs.asp.net/nunitaddin/ and see what they are doing to the developer of one of the most popular dev tools. Crazy, crazy, crazy. There you have a discussion already going on whether alpha programmers are leaving the MS platform (google for Fowler’s latest blog, or Sam Gentile) and then they engage in crap like that. Hard to believe, but apparently true. Even if they are legally right (which I don’t actually think, these EULA’s have a very dubios status in some countries), this is just terrible business behavior, i.e. essentially only a monopolist can act like that.

  27. http://weblogs.asp.net/nunitaddin/archive/2007/05/30/microsoft-vs-testdriven-net-express.aspx

    I think the evangelism team should answer for this actually.
    As high priced as Sun hardware is, I’ve NEVER seen them go after an individual for developing addons to Netbeans or Eclipse.

    Or patenting somebody elses invention
    http://www.bluej.org/mrt/?p=21

    When I recommend against MS technology it’s 50% based on this. I could publish some pretty bad emails between myself and Rory Blyth, and that would be the other 50%. I will eventually anyway when the time is right.

    These limitations make using the platform hindering and cumbersome at best. Sun’s hardware restrictions are similarly cumbersome, but not as purely evil as Microsoft’s.

  28. http://weblogs.asp.net/nunitaddin/archive/2007/05/30/microsoft-vs-testdriven-net-express.aspx

    I think the evangelism team should answer for this actually.
    As high priced as Sun hardware is, I’ve NEVER seen them go after an individual for developing addons to Netbeans or Eclipse.

    Or patenting somebody elses invention
    http://www.bluej.org/mrt/?p=21

    When I recommend against MS technology it’s 50% based on this. I could publish some pretty bad emails between myself and Rory Blyth, and that would be the other 50%. I will eventually anyway when the time is right.

    These limitations make using the platform hindering and cumbersome at best. Sun’s hardware restrictions are similarly cumbersome, but not as purely evil as Microsoft’s.

  29. @davidacode/16 and @Chris/18 -

    Hello,

    I don’t want to comment on this specific issue on a public site for three reasons :

    1. I believe a *lot* (and I mean a *LOT*) has been said and discussed on this matter. The reality is that the entire communication that happened between the two parties has been made public and everyone has formed their own opinions (rightfully, so). There’s not much value I can add at this time.

    2. I don’t know enough about what happened. I could read all I want, and talk to all my co-workers and MVPs and involved parties, but the reality is that blogs are subjective and opinionated. I wasn’t involved in this from the start and it looks like it’s gotten a phase where it needs to be resolved the way it is being resolved.

    3. It seems a tad unrelated to Scoble’s post :)

    Thanks,

    ai

  30. @davidacode/16 and @Chris/18 -

    Hello,

    I don’t want to comment on this specific issue on a public site for three reasons :

    1. I believe a *lot* (and I mean a *LOT*) has been said and discussed on this matter. The reality is that the entire communication that happened between the two parties has been made public and everyone has formed their own opinions (rightfully, so). There’s not much value I can add at this time.

    2. I don’t know enough about what happened. I could read all I want, and talk to all my co-workers and MVPs and involved parties, but the reality is that blogs are subjective and opinionated. I wasn’t involved in this from the start and it looks like it’s gotten a phase where it needs to be resolved the way it is being resolved.

    3. It seems a tad unrelated to Scoble’s post :)

    Thanks,

    ai

  31. The MS/Claria deal was totally unrelated to Scoble as an evangelist at Microsoft, and yet through his diligence, he pissed a 500 million dollar deal away for the company almost single handedly.

    If your hands are tied on this little matter after former evangelists have done far more, then I think you should reconsider your job.

  32. The MS/Claria deal was totally unrelated to Scoble as an evangelist at Microsoft, and yet through his diligence, he pissed a 500 million dollar deal away for the company almost single handedly.

    If your hands are tied on this little matter after former evangelists have done far more, then I think you should reconsider your job.

  33. Chris: I might be an egotistical baaahhhhsssstttaaarrrddd and take credit for everything under the sun. But this deal wasn’t killed cause of me. It might have something to do with the hundreds of other bloggers who went nuts.

  34. Chris: I might be an egotistical baaahhhhsssstttaaarrrddd and take credit for everything under the sun. But this deal wasn’t killed cause of me. It might have something to do with the hundreds of other bloggers who went nuts.

  35. @Chris/23 -

    I don’t know – it doesn’t seem right that we can compare these two issues. They’re not the same at all. In fact, they’re not comparable in any way.

    > If your hands are tied on this little matter

    1. My hands aren’t necessarily tied (I don’t remember saying that). I’ve explained why I don’t want to comment about this issue on a public site (see comment # 22)
    2. It’s not a little matter. Nothing is.

    > I think you should reconsider your job

    Jeez, sounds really extreme to me… But just because you asked, I just did [reconsider my job]. And I want to continue doing what I do.

    Jokes aside, the one thing I must let you know about us at Microsoft (probably rather obvious) – we are a vocal bunch. Some evangelists have done PHENOMENAL work to influence change by convincing management to listen to our customers, developer communities etc. One of the most recent examples being how a few of us evangelists propagated the customer voice to management about wanting certain Expression products in MSDN – http://blogs.msdn.com/somasegar/archive/2007/04/03/listening-to-your-feedback-expression-and-msdn.aspx

    So, bottom-line, I (we) will fight for what I (we) believe in.

    Hope that helps,

    ai

  36. @Chris/23 -

    I don’t know – it doesn’t seem right that we can compare these two issues. They’re not the same at all. In fact, they’re not comparable in any way.

    > If your hands are tied on this little matter

    1. My hands aren’t necessarily tied (I don’t remember saying that). I’ve explained why I don’t want to comment about this issue on a public site (see comment # 22)
    2. It’s not a little matter. Nothing is.

    > I think you should reconsider your job

    Jeez, sounds really extreme to me… But just because you asked, I just did [reconsider my job]. And I want to continue doing what I do.

    Jokes aside, the one thing I must let you know about us at Microsoft (probably rather obvious) – we are a vocal bunch. Some evangelists have done PHENOMENAL work to influence change by convincing management to listen to our customers, developer communities etc. One of the most recent examples being how a few of us evangelists propagated the customer voice to management about wanting certain Expression products in MSDN – http://blogs.msdn.com/somasegar/archive/2007/04/03/listening-to-your-feedback-expression-and-msdn.aspx

    So, bottom-line, I (we) will fight for what I (we) believe in.

    Hope that helps,

    ai

  37. I am another one of those “obscure evangelists” who has no impact on what the company does (I also have my phone number posted to my blog). If that is what people wish to believe, so be it. Maybe I do and maybe I don’t. It isn’t YOUR performance review that gets impacted by what I do. :) I believe that I (and AI) play a part in opening doors into Microsoft and positively impacting customer perception. If we accomplish that, I am happy.

    @Get Real – “You think that a field sales evangelist isn’t going to try to sell you? You don’t (sic) MSFT all that well.” – Neither AI or myself are “field sales evangelists”. Sales isn’t in our titles or job descriptions. *I* am an ITPro Evangelist. While I am a shareholder and like the idea of people buying as much MS product as posisble, it isn’t in my job description to get people to buy. My goal is to get people to implement what they already have, resolve issues that may arise in day-to-day run time scenarios, and be a conduit into the company.

    Call me if you have any technical issues…. :)

    chris

  38. I am another one of those “obscure evangelists” who has no impact on what the company does (I also have my phone number posted to my blog). If that is what people wish to believe, so be it. Maybe I do and maybe I don’t. It isn’t YOUR performance review that gets impacted by what I do. :) I believe that I (and AI) play a part in opening doors into Microsoft and positively impacting customer perception. If we accomplish that, I am happy.

    @Get Real – “You think that a field sales evangelist isn’t going to try to sell you? You don’t (sic) MSFT all that well.” – Neither AI or myself are “field sales evangelists”. Sales isn’t in our titles or job descriptions. *I* am an ITPro Evangelist. While I am a shareholder and like the idea of people buying as much MS product as posisble, it isn’t in my job description to get people to buy. My goal is to get people to implement what they already have, resolve issues that may arise in day-to-day run time scenarios, and be a conduit into the company.

    Call me if you have any technical issues…. :)

    chris

  39. @17/Yes,

    I somehow missed your comment all together…

    > If not, you’re holding the line short term, we
    > appreciate that, keep up the good work, but admit
    > that longer term, the ineffectiveness will set in.

    I can’t admit that… Because, I don’t know. Maybe it will, maybe it wont. I have colleagues (including my director) who’ve been in the field, in evangelist-like roles for over 13 years. The fire is still burning. And I’m not saying that I’m like them, or that people haven’t gotten disgruntled in the past. But I have to live in the now and believe. thanks,

    ai

  40. @17/Yes,

    I somehow missed your comment all together…

    > If not, you’re holding the line short term, we
    > appreciate that, keep up the good work, but admit
    > that longer term, the ineffectiveness will set in.

    I can’t admit that… Because, I don’t know. Maybe it will, maybe it wont. I have colleagues (including my director) who’ve been in the field, in evangelist-like roles for over 13 years. The fire is still burning. And I’m not saying that I’m like them, or that people haven’t gotten disgruntled in the past. But I have to live in the now and believe. thanks,

    ai