I’m a noise junkie. I used to be a news junkie, but I’ve hung out with the world’s top journalists enough now to see that the good ones are noise junkies. They are the types that head into a crowded party and listen to pitch after pitch (noise) and drunken story after drunken story (noise) to find something that their audiences will find interesting (news). I’m not the only one who likes the noise: Hutch Carpenter defends the noise too.
Last year I got a tour of the Wall Street Journal’s West Coast printing plant. They print 60,000 copies an hour. At the end of the tour the head pressman said “I’ve been reading this six hours before you did for more than 15 years now and it hasn’t helped yet.” Why? Cause the news isn’t where the action is: the high value bits are stuck in the noise.
I’ve been studying noise and news now for quite a while. I’ve been wondering why sites like Google News and TechMeme have no, or little, noise? Tomorrow I’ll tour the New York Times headquarters in New York to pick up even more tips of how they make sure noise doesn’t sneak onto its pages.
First, let’s do a little definition of the difference between news and noise. The noise examples were pulled off of Twitter in the past few minutes.
NEWS: tens of thousands dead in China quake.
NOISE: BrianGreene: some pirate is playing old radio nova tapes on 92FM dublin, with old jingles and old ads. adverts for rent a 20″ TV 48p a day (48 pence!)
NEWS: Janitors go on strike.
NOISE: flawlesswalrus: @craigmod Iron Man’s fun times. Enjoy!
NEWS: Facebook blocks Google
NOISE: dmkanter: organizing my igoogle homepage
So, how come services like Twitter and FriendFeed have so much noise? Who likes the noise? Who likes the news?
I like the noise. Why? Because I can see patterns before anyone else. I saw the Chinese earthquake happening 45 minutes before Google News reported it. Why? Because I was watching the noise, not the news.
Let me ask you something. Do you think Walt Mossberg will wake up tomorrow and worry about what’s on TechMeme or Google News, or will he sit through yet another boring PR pitch from some gadget company trying to find something unique to tell his readers?
The news is in the noise. Which is why Twitter is crack for newsmakers. There’s no better place to find noise, er news, than on Twitter. Even on FriendFeed there’s less noise than there is on Twitter (if you subscribe to both). Why? Because of the “Hide” link and clustering. I can put 156 Tweets in my Twitter follower’s faces, blocking all other Twitterers from getting to their pages. But on FriendFeed? All my Tweets are clustered together and blocked from view unless you expand them to read them all.
So, anyway, how does Google News and Techmeme keep the noise from hitting their pages?
Google News: Only tracks sites that have “teams” of people working on them. That usually means there’s an organized effort. That alone blocks 99.9% of bloggers and Twitterers from even being considered.
TechMeme: requires multiple “votes” by an elite to get on the page. Even a link from TechCrunch (which is the #1 “voter” on TechMeme) won’t get you onto Techmeme. You’ve gotta have something else to go with that link.
Google News: the more “big city newspapers and news sources” that cover something, the more likely that story will get to the home page.
TechMeme: watches signaling from key members on Twitter and Google Reader. If enough people who are on the TechMeme Leaderboard Twitter and share an item on Google Reader you’ll see the item pulled onto the page.
Both Google News and Techmeme: only stuff in past 24 hours gets onto the page.
What differentiates Techmeme and Google News? Google News only considers news from news teams (mostly, only a few blogs are there among hundreds of thousands of newspapers, TV stations, magazines, and news blogs like Huffington Post). Techmeme? Looks at Twitter and Google Reader for signaling mechanisms (what news is getting hot) but mostly considers blog posts and professional journalism that have gotten the attention of a limited number of “elite” bloggers/journalists. Techmeme gets news from sources that aren’t always professionally run sites, which is the biggest differentiator. Techmeme could be said to have more noise than Google News, which is what makes it more interesting than Google News — to me. To my dad? I bet he’d like Google News better because it only has news, no noise.
The problem with both Google News and Techmeme? New ideas and new people won’t get onto the page easily. You have to convince multiple people who control these sites that your stuff is important. In Google News’ case you’ll probably have to publish your news on a site that already is added to Google News’ database. That’s one reason why I see Dave Winer’s stuff only when he writes for Huffington Post show up there. Convincing someone like Huffington Post that you’re important enough to publish is pretty hard and takes building up a reputation and an audience of your own.
If you’re looking for new faces and new conversations that haven’t yet gotten to be important enough to get onto Google News or Techmeme, then FriendFeed and Twitter are far better places to hang out.
Getting on TechMeme? You better convince someone near the top of the TechMeme leader board (getting me to link to you doesn’t really matter unless someone in the top five also links to you) to talk about you and link to you. That’s really hard. Why? Cause we don’t agree on what’s important. You can see that come out in last Friday’s Gillmor Gang. Heck, we’re yelling at each other on the phone. You think we’re going to decide to link to you? Hah!
I know Google News and TechMeme will get more of a mainstream audience because all they report is news, but excuse me if I spend a lot more time over on Twitter and FriendFeed swimming in the noise.
hurah for the noise. nicely written.
hurah for the noise. nicely written.
straightrecord, fair point about my list of named. I completely agree that the majority of the world’s best journalists go unknown. Which only reinforces my question that Scoble provide evidence to support his narccistic claim
straightrecord, fair point about my list of named. I completely agree that the majority of the world’s best journalists go unknown. Which only reinforces my question that Scoble provide evidence to support his narccistic claim
I am wondering what advantage did anyone gain by virtue of all of the early “Noise” generated about the earthquake on Twitter. Did anyone use this information to take any action what so ever to help anyone or did you all just congratulate each other for knowing first….
Noise is for twits news is for people who are too busy doing things that matter to have time to sift thrugh the noise.
I am wondering what advantage did anyone gain by virtue of all of the early “Noise” generated about the earthquake on Twitter. Did anyone use this information to take any action what so ever to help anyone or did you all just congratulate each other for knowing first….
Noise is for twits news is for people who are too busy doing things that matter to have time to sift thrugh the noise.
Noise as you call it can be a way of quickly receiving what is practically just the latest news, but on the other hand it usually is also highly inaccurate as details have yet to be revealed.
An indication that something happened which is getting people’s attention but it’s usually not till the actual news arrives before people really get to know what it’s about.
Asides from that, don’t forget that essentially most noise is just coming from the news directly, quickly mentioned by one which happened to be watching the news. It’s not like it instantly came from those right at the source of things.
In case you have the time on your hands though to follow what’s happening in the world by doing so on services like twitter, blogs or any other form of independent journalism on the net nothing is going to stop you. But for those with less time on their hands google news is all they need, or perhaps better to say what they can spare.
On the other hand, noise is far from a bad thing either. Not that I give anything on whether someone knows it before me or not, but simply for the fact that it creates awareness. After all, better to pick up the latest news through the noise than not picking it up at all.
Noise as you call it can be a way of quickly receiving what is practically just the latest news, but on the other hand it usually is also highly inaccurate as details have yet to be revealed.
An indication that something happened which is getting people’s attention but it’s usually not till the actual news arrives before people really get to know what it’s about.
Asides from that, don’t forget that essentially most noise is just coming from the news directly, quickly mentioned by one which happened to be watching the news. It’s not like it instantly came from those right at the source of things.
In case you have the time on your hands though to follow what’s happening in the world by doing so on services like twitter, blogs or any other form of independent journalism on the net nothing is going to stop you. But for those with less time on their hands google news is all they need, or perhaps better to say what they can spare.
On the other hand, noise is far from a bad thing either. Not that I give anything on whether someone knows it before me or not, but simply for the fact that it creates awareness. After all, better to pick up the latest news through the noise than not picking it up at all.
Oh, I love this post. It’s the difference between process and product, in therapyspeak.
Oh, I love this post. It’s the difference between process and product, in therapyspeak.
Noise should be avoided. Typically, noise is poorly written. Editors are undervalued. If you read a large volume of noise, your writing will suffer. Filters, such as Google News, help.
Noise should be avoided. Typically, noise is poorly written. Editors are undervalued. If you read a large volume of noise, your writing will suffer. Filters, such as Google News, help.
[...] Scoble Gone Crazy with the noise issue! Damm [...]
There are some GREAT comments here!
That NOISE is the sound of ideas being formed as the Internet moves; it’s to be embraced by those who want to see the future in advance!
I just wrote a post about Robert’s influence on my blog. It’s about time he gets the ‘props’ he deserves – what Scoble’s achieved in amazing – stunning. http://thetechnewsblog.com/2008/05/19/the-scoble-effect/
Jim Connolly
The Tech News Blog
There are some GREAT comments here!
That NOISE is the sound of ideas being formed as the Internet moves; it’s to be embraced by those who want to see the future in advance!
I just wrote a post about Robert’s influence on my blog. It’s about time he gets the ‘props’ he deserves – what Scoble’s achieved in amazing – stunning. http://thetechnewsblog.com/2008/05/19/the-scoble-effect/
Jim Connolly
The Tech News Blog
[...] week the blogging buzz was all about FriendFeed, and it looks like it’s continued into this week as well with Robert Scoble’s recent post entitled “Why FriendFeed won’t go [...]
[...] dans ses pensées ce soir : “Les journalistes se shootent au bruit, nous rappelle Scoble… dans les cocktails pour les traditionalistes, sur les sites de “conversations” pour les plus [...]
[...] bring this up because Robert Scoble, a long-time blogger and managing director at Fast Company, posted thoughts on News versus [...]
noise
n.
1) A stench in the ear. Undomesticated music. The chief product and authenticating sign of civilization.
2)In Computer Science, irrelevant or meaningless data.
1)Devil’s Dictionary
2)American Heritage Dictionary
noise
n.
1) A stench in the ear. Undomesticated music. The chief product and authenticating sign of civilization.
2)In Computer Science, irrelevant or meaningless data.
1)Devil’s Dictionary
2)American Heritage Dictionary
[...] nieuws (als kanarie in de kolenmijn), het lokaal filteren van gesprekken, het luisteren naar de ruis (handig voor journalisten), het verslaan van rechtszaken… Lees ook dit, dit, dit, [...]
The noise of Twitter and Friendfeed are interesting to you because you’re writing about Twitter and Friendfeed. It wouldn’t be any use to anyone who doesn’t cover those areas. You sound to me like an old-time newsman who advises a youngster to hang around the police station because that’s where it’s all happening. Well, on the crime beat that’s good advice. But what if you cover City Hall?
The noise of Twitter and Friendfeed are interesting to you because you’re writing about Twitter and Friendfeed. It wouldn’t be any use to anyone who doesn’t cover those areas. You sound to me like an old-time newsman who advises a youngster to hang around the police station because that’s where it’s all happening. Well, on the crime beat that’s good advice. But what if you cover City Hall?
[...] an excellent piece on mobile phone functionality in which he referenced a recent post by Scoble, Why Google News has no noise. Scoble’s thesis is that he is able to spot trends in news before the main web news carriers, [...]
[...] a link to Scoble’s post:http://scobleizer.com/2008/05/18/why-google-news-has-no-noise/ Filed under: Uncategorized [...]
[...] lúcido post de Robert Scoble, que los periodistas de tecnología deberíamos tener en cuenta: “Do you think Walt [...]
[...] Why Google News has no noise. Scobleizer — Tech geek blogger » Blog Archive: Twitter ist Crack für Newsjunkies. Wie wahr. (tags: twitter crack noise news) [...]
[...] other day Ed Dale twittered a link to a post by Robert Scoble about news vs. noise, which is, in a strange way, the inspiration for this [...]
So… what would happen if politicians start listening to the noise instead of to the news (and big statistic reports and such)
And…
What would happen when corporate companies start listening to the noise instead of to the news? Oh.. a… wait… I guess that’s called marketing or maybe customer service but what are the executives doing?
I am sure one day that -will- happen. But not today. And not tomorrow.
So… what would happen if politicians start listening to the noise instead of to the news (and big statistic reports and such)
And…
What would happen when corporate companies start listening to the noise instead of to the news? Oh.. a… wait… I guess that’s called marketing or maybe customer service but what are the executives doing?
I am sure one day that -will- happen. But not today. And not tomorrow.
[...] wrote a post about news v. noise (link). The premise was a simple question of whether you enjoy information from 1 of 2 [...]
[...] career trying to elevate and deliver information above the noise, so Robert Scoble’s recent post on the value of tuning into the “noise” itself gave me reason for pause. “I’m a [...]
[...] influential. Whether that is true or not outside the Silicon Valley bubblesphere is debatable. But in this post analyzed by Joe McKendrick, we learn that Scoble thinks: I like the [Twitter etc] noise. Why? [...]
[...] Twitter: Finding Breaking News Through the Noise "The news is in the noise. Which is why Twitter is crack for newsmakers. There’s no better place to find noise, er news, than on Twitter." [...]
[...] to expect the emergence of a high-quality news source, folks such as Robert Scoble keep calling for more noise. Personally, I want that source Crichton dreams of, but I don’t expect it to go mainstream [...]
[...] FriendFeed NoiseReadWriteWeb: Don’t Be So Naive: Friendfeed Adds to the NoiseScobleizer: Why Google News has no noiseScobleizer: Why FriendFeed won’t go mainstream (Part I)Scobleizer: Why FriendFeed will go [...]
[...] Eventuell findet hier ein Team eine Lösung, denn Attention Crash zu umgehen. Die vielbeschworene Signal-to-Noise-Ratio, d.h. der Anteil der individuell relevanten Informationen an den gesamt konsumierten Informationen, [...]
[...] Twitter has been getting some publicity lately, looking at its value as a reporting tool. Here are some articles on the subject:http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/05/19/twitter-as-the-canary-in-the-news-coalmine/http://scobleizer.com/2008/05/18/why-google-news-has-no-noise/http://www.pbs.org/mediashift/2008/05/microblogging_maniatwitter_hel.htmlhttp://www.techcrunch.com/2008/04/30/project-vino-twitter-wine-tasting/http://onlinejournalismblog.wordpress.com/2008/04/30/how-journalists-can-master-twitter/http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/twitter_for_journalists.phphttp://www.journalism.co.uk/7/articles/531439.php [...]
[...] Scoble employs apophenia as part of his profession. In one of his posts, he says: “I like the noise. Why? Because I can see patterns before anyone [...]
[...] for dismissing Twitter for hosting too much noise uber blogger (and Twitterer) Robert Scoble makes an interesting case against that. “The news is in the noise. Which is why Twitter is crack for newsmakers. There’s no better [...]
[...] Noise. In allen [...]
[...] Isn’t the 140 character update the “contextual” update and the reason to talk? We are signaling everyone all the time! And unlike the traditional services these are open. And I’d say this [...]
[...] (…) Dunque, bisogna anticipare il buzz, nel momento in cui prende forma, quando è ancora soltanto del « rumore » e non è ancora diventato « attualità ». E’ esattamente questo approccio che segnala Francis Pisani, su Transnet, citando Robert Scoble : [...]
[...] El artículo de esta semana lo escribió Robert Scoble hace un tiempo y habla sobre el uso de Twitter como fuente de información de datos interesantes para enriquecer la labor periodística. Se llama Why Google News has no Noise. [...]
[...] up searches on Twitter and Friendfeed for your organization’s name. As Robert Scoble says, the news is in the noise. Doing this will allow you to identify, track, and hopefully respond to, potential issues before [...]
[...] to get you going. And for a contrarian point of view on the whole signal-to-noise thing, check out Scoble. (Or, maybe he’s mainstream and I’m the contrarian? [...]
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[...] chat but because the noise stream will contain the odd nugget – just like panning for gold. He argues that only those willing to sift through the dirt will strike it rich and those covering only the [...]
Hey there, i don't think so, what makes you say that btw!
Hey there, i don't think so, what makes you say that btw!