Why Google News has no noise

I’m a noise junkie. I used to be a news junkie, but I’ve hung out with the world’s top journalists enough now to see that the good ones are noise junkies. They are the types that head into a crowded party and listen to pitch after pitch (noise) and drunken story after drunken story (noise) to find something that their audiences will find interesting (news). I’m not the only one who likes the noise: Hutch Carpenter defends the noise too.

Last year I got a tour of the Wall Street Journal’s West Coast printing plant. They print 60,000 copies an hour. At the end of the tour the head pressman said “I’ve been reading this six hours before you did for more than 15 years now and it hasn’t helped yet.” Why? Cause the news isn’t where the action is: the high value bits are stuck in the noise.

I’ve been studying noise and news now for quite a while. I’ve been wondering why sites like Google News and TechMeme have no, or little, noise? Tomorrow I’ll tour the New York Times headquarters in New York to pick up even more tips of how they make sure noise doesn’t sneak onto its pages.

First, let’s do a little definition of the difference between news and noise. The noise examples were pulled off of Twitter in the past few minutes.

NEWS: tens of thousands dead in China quake.
NOISE: BrianGreene: some pirate is playing old radio nova tapes on 92FM dublin, with old jingles and old ads. adverts for rent a 20″ TV 48p a day (48 pence!)

NEWS: Janitors go on strike.
NOISE: flawlesswalrus: @craigmod Iron Man’s fun times. Enjoy!

NEWS: Facebook blocks Google
NOISE: dmkanter: organizing my igoogle homepage

So, how come services like Twitter and FriendFeed have so much noise? Who likes the noise? Who likes the news?

I like the noise. Why? Because I can see patterns before anyone else. I saw the Chinese earthquake happening 45 minutes before Google News reported it. Why? Because I was watching the noise, not the news.

Let me ask you something. Do you think Walt Mossberg will wake up tomorrow and worry about what’s on TechMeme or Google News, or will he sit through yet another boring PR pitch from some gadget company trying to find something unique to tell his readers?

The news is in the noise. Which is why Twitter is crack for newsmakers. There’s no better place to find noise, er news, than on Twitter. Even on FriendFeed there’s less noise than there is on Twitter (if you subscribe to both). Why? Because of the “Hide” link and clustering. I can put 156 Tweets in my Twitter follower’s faces, blocking all other Twitterers from getting to their pages. But on FriendFeed? All my Tweets are clustered together and blocked from view unless you expand them to read them all.

So, anyway, how does Google News and Techmeme keep the noise from hitting their pages?

Google News: Only tracks sites that have “teams” of people working on them. That usually means there’s an organized effort. That alone blocks 99.9% of bloggers and Twitterers from even being considered.

TechMeme: requires multiple “votes” by an elite to get on the page. Even a link from TechCrunch (which is the #1 “voter” on TechMeme) won’t get you onto Techmeme. You’ve gotta have something else to go with that link.

Google News: the more “big city newspapers and news sources” that cover something, the more likely that story will get to the home page.

TechMeme: watches signaling from key members on Twitter and Google Reader. If enough people who are on the TechMeme Leaderboard Twitter and share an item on Google Reader you’ll see the item pulled onto the page.

Both Google News and Techmeme: only stuff in past 24 hours gets onto the page.

What differentiates Techmeme and Google News? Google News only considers news from news teams (mostly, only a few blogs are there among hundreds of thousands of newspapers, TV stations, magazines, and news blogs like Huffington Post). Techmeme? Looks at Twitter and Google Reader for signaling mechanisms (what news is getting hot) but mostly considers blog posts and professional journalism that have gotten the attention of a limited number of “elite” bloggers/journalists. Techmeme gets news from sources that aren’t always professionally run sites, which is the biggest differentiator. Techmeme could be said to have more noise than Google News, which is what makes it more interesting than Google News — to me. To my dad? I bet he’d like Google News better because it only has news, no noise.

The problem with both Google News and Techmeme? New ideas and new people won’t get onto the page easily. You have to convince multiple people who control these sites that your stuff is important. In Google News’ case you’ll probably have to publish your news on a site that already is added to Google News’ database. That’s one reason why I see Dave Winer’s stuff only when he writes for Huffington Post show up there. Convincing someone like Huffington Post that you’re important enough to publish is pretty hard and takes building up a reputation and an audience of your own.

If you’re looking for new faces and new conversations that haven’t yet gotten to be important enough to get onto Google News or Techmeme, then FriendFeed and Twitter are far better places to hang out.

Getting on TechMeme? You better convince someone near the top of the TechMeme leader board (getting me to link to you doesn’t really matter unless someone in the top five also links to you) to talk about you and link to you. That’s really hard. Why? Cause we don’t agree on what’s important. You can see that come out in last Friday’s Gillmor Gang. Heck, we’re yelling at each other on the phone. You think we’re going to decide to link to you? Hah!

I know Google News and TechMeme will get more of a mainstream audience because all they report is news, but excuse me if I spend a lot more time over on Twitter and FriendFeed swimming in the noise.

  • http://blog.taragana.com Angsuman Chakraborty

    I prefer selective noise over plain old news. In other words I decide which topics are of interest to me and follow only those, noise and news. That is more efficient than just noise, which can sometimes drive you crazy (at least it does that to me).

  • http://www.piedcow.com/blog mal

    recently i’ve been ‘track’ing one word on twitter. design. so anytime anyone anywhere twitters anything about the design of anything i get an instant message. (getting it going is kind of quirky – but once you do it feels way more newsy than news) Perhaps as its easy to filter out the noise. there is a personal element too – not someone paid to produce fluff – but someone interested in something enough to pull out their phone and type in 140 characters while in the midst of their friends or families or board meetings… I guess the word for design is design – at least in several languages so far…

    here’s a sampling:

    (wheelscore): The German Car Blog: Audi A3 Clubsport quattro: Cool design study made for W… – http://wheelscore.com/out.php?id=278161

    (designcarter): Design[grin]ivide – Markup + FTP + Terminal + More = Coda = Awesomeness!: I’ve alwa.. http://tinyurl.com/658mjc

    (ernohannink): Nieuw op HappyHouris Design kan ook gelukkig maken: Een leuke presentatie over ho.. http://twurl.nl/xz8mhz

    (TChed): Starbucks Under fire for new logo design: http://tinyurl.com/5a3z4x

    (candiluu): @jaimef Miami Vice is an excelent example of poor sound design.

    (devfunnel): [design: A List Apart] Zebra Striping: Does it Really Help? http://www.alistapart.com/articles/zebrastripingdoesithelp

    (askrom): I [heart] design history, but when a designer claims that today’s challenges are no different than decades ago, they just seem old and bitter.

    (devfunnel): [design: COLOURlovers] When I’m Horny http://tinyurl.com/6xlhaz

    (twHIVE_W20): [-O] Finishing up a CMS with an oversized design for old people in redlands …catering to old peo.. http://tinyurl.com/55wq7t

    (sarahatwood): @douglassarine well, i wouldn’t recommend you get ladies underwear but if you insist the design goes in the back

    (tjreo): Trying to prefer twitterific over twhirl but just can’t. Features important to me win out over beautiful design.

    (melmcbride): why must they design so many women’s products with Barbie doll aesthetics? http://tinyurl.com/64r66n

    (makkura): How Design ’08 opening keynote!! The fun starts now!!
    Sent at 4:03 PM on Sunday

    (hans_engel): New site design is live! Sorry for the stinky ‘About Me’ section – I was never good at writing those. http://is.gd/ihK

    (laurict): Interior design suggestion: when building a public men’s room, don’t install highly reflective tile behind the toilet. Mildly disturbing.

    (kingkool68): New blog post: Steve Jobs Cannot Design A Mouse http://tinyurl.com/5wbhkj

    (kbondelli): I don’t even want to think about the hours lost in web design because Microsoft made an inferior product in IE and people choose to use it

    (JamiePappas): Great post by @chrisbrogan re: blog design – check it out! http://tinyurl.com/6q5zhw

    (designforum): Graphic Design Forum Dosugus cushion: Dosugus cushion looks like a black screen a.. http://tinyurl.com/5m2s2d

    (wordpressjob): New job posted! WordPress blog design http://tinyurl.com/6bvnr6

    (AndyLenz): schönes neues design bei meinem neuen #twitter lieblingsdienst #twitturly http://twitturly.com/

    (TheJoshuaTree): I dont know why, but every-time I listen to Design Matters With Debbie Millman, I feel like a carp designer :/

    (Beaverdale): Drinking ACME pale ale just because I like the retro-y design of the label (but it is pretty darn good beer). Every day should be like this.

  • http://www.piedcow.com/blog mal

    recently i’ve been ‘track’ing one word on twitter. design. so anytime anyone anywhere twitters anything about the design of anything i get an instant message. (getting it going is kind of quirky – but once you do it feels way more newsy than news) Perhaps as its easy to filter out the noise. there is a personal element too – not someone paid to produce fluff – but someone interested in something enough to pull out their phone and type in 140 characters while in the midst of their friends or families or board meetings… I guess the word for design is design – at least in several languages so far…

    here’s a sampling:

    (wheelscore): The German Car Blog: Audi A3 Clubsport quattro: Cool design study made for W… – http://wheelscore.com/out.php?id=278161

    (designcarter): Design[grin]ivide – Markup + FTP + Terminal + More = Coda = Awesomeness!: I’ve alwa.. http://tinyurl.com/658mjc

    (ernohannink): Nieuw op HappyHouris Design kan ook gelukkig maken: Een leuke presentatie over ho.. http://twurl.nl/xz8mhz

    (TChed): Starbucks Under fire for new logo design: http://tinyurl.com/5a3z4x

    (candiluu): @jaimef Miami Vice is an excelent example of poor sound design.

    (devfunnel): [design: A List Apart] Zebra Striping: Does it Really Help? http://www.alistapart.com/articles/zebrastripingdoesithelp

    (askrom): I [heart] design history, but when a designer claims that today’s challenges are no different than decades ago, they just seem old and bitter.

    (devfunnel): [design: COLOURlovers] When I’m Horny http://tinyurl.com/6xlhaz

    (twHIVE_W20): [-O] Finishing up a CMS with an oversized design for old people in redlands …catering to old peo.. http://tinyurl.com/55wq7t

    (sarahatwood): @douglassarine well, i wouldn’t recommend you get ladies underwear but if you insist the design goes in the back

    (tjreo): Trying to prefer twitterific over twhirl but just can’t. Features important to me win out over beautiful design.

    (melmcbride): why must they design so many women’s products with Barbie doll aesthetics? http://tinyurl.com/64r66n

    (makkura): How Design ’08 opening keynote!! The fun starts now!!
    Sent at 4:03 PM on Sunday

    (hans_engel): New site design is live! Sorry for the stinky ‘About Me’ section – I was never good at writing those. http://is.gd/ihK

    (laurict): Interior design suggestion: when building a public men’s room, don’t install highly reflective tile behind the toilet. Mildly disturbing.

    (kingkool68): New blog post: Steve Jobs Cannot Design A Mouse http://tinyurl.com/5wbhkj

    (kbondelli): I don’t even want to think about the hours lost in web design because Microsoft made an inferior product in IE and people choose to use it

    (JamiePappas): Great post by @chrisbrogan re: blog design – check it out! http://tinyurl.com/6q5zhw

    (designforum): Graphic Design Forum Dosugus cushion: Dosugus cushion looks like a black screen a.. http://tinyurl.com/5m2s2d

    (wordpressjob): New job posted! WordPress blog design http://tinyurl.com/6bvnr6

    (AndyLenz): schönes neues design bei meinem neuen #twitter lieblingsdienst #twitturly http://twitturly.com/

    (TheJoshuaTree): I dont know why, but every-time I listen to Design Matters With Debbie Millman, I feel like a carp designer :/

    (Beaverdale): Drinking ACME pale ale just because I like the retro-y design of the label (but it is pretty darn good beer). Every day should be like this.

  • http://scobleizer.com/ Robert Scoble

    Michael: interesting to compare your comment to that of Randy Holloway at http://randyh.wordpress.com/2008/05/18/the-news-is-in-the-noise/

  • http://scobleizer.com/ Robert Scoble

    Michael: interesting to compare your comment to that of Randy Holloway at http://randyh.wordpress.com/2008/05/18/the-news-is-in-the-noise/

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  • http://www.bladam.com/ Adam

    > Scoble, you are utterly worthless.

    Yo, Michael C… I find that I disagree with Scoble more often than I agree with him, but dude, what’s with the *personal* hate? Given that you clearly have no interest in, nay, actually can’t stand his commentary, why read it? The Internet’s a grand, big, and flexible place. Find some corners you like and perhaps save on blood pressure medication :-)

  • http://www.bladam.com/ Adam

    > Scoble, you are utterly worthless.

    Yo, Michael C… I find that I disagree with Scoble more often than I agree with him, but dude, what’s with the *personal* hate? Given that you clearly have no interest in, nay, actually can’t stand his commentary, why read it? The Internet’s a grand, big, and flexible place. Find some corners you like and perhaps save on blood pressure medication :-)

  • http://www.marketingsuccessblueprint.com/blog Paul Elliott

    Thank you, Robert.

    “Noise” before the China quake? Does that mean you are really a Princeton Egg in disguise?

  • http://www.marketingsuccessblueprint.com/blog Paul Elliott

    Thank you, Robert.

    “Noise” before the China quake? Does that mean you are really a Princeton Egg in disguise?

  • Larry

    Who cares if you knew about the China earthquake before the US new media? There were people in China who knew before you. Who cares.

  • Larry

    Who cares if you knew about the China earthquake before the US new media? There were people in China who knew before you. Who cares.

  • Larry

    BTW scoble, I discovered google.com 45 minutes before you did. Who cares. So you were interviewed on bozo US news media. Millions of people in Asia knew about the earthquake before you. Why don’t you search for extraterrestrial life or something useful?

  • Larry

    BTW scoble, I discovered google.com 45 minutes before you did. Who cares. So you were interviewed on bozo US news media. Millions of people in Asia knew about the earthquake before you. Why don’t you search for extraterrestrial life or something useful?

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  • http://guglelive.com/ Chhai

    Noise is wonderfully useful to get the latest news. I’m attempting a method to filter out the noise to get the news from across the web without actually using/relying on a specific service like Twitter.

  • http://guglelive.com Chhai

    Noise is wonderfully useful to get the latest news. I’m attempting a method to filter out the noise to get the news from across the web without actually using/relying on a specific service like Twitter.

  • http://www.techmeme.com/ Gabe

    Andy Beard’s comment is right. Robert’s reply to Andy is wrong. Robert, techmeme.com/lb is an output, not an input. And there are many, many blogs whose links send juice/love/rank equal to TechCrunch’s.

  • http://www.techmeme.com/ Gabe

    Andy Beard’s comment is right. Robert’s reply to Andy is wrong. Robert, techmeme.com/lb is an output, not an input. And there are many, many blogs whose links send juice/love/rank equal to TechCrunch’s.

  • http://www.consumerpassion.com/ Jeff Crites

    Interesting take on noise vs news. I’ve always been an information junkie, a mix of noise and news I guess. I enjoy skimming through numerous blog posts and info bits from Twitter each day. I also enjoy magazine articles – things that aren’t time sensitive – that go behind the scenes or look over the horizon for trends. And when I can, I do a quick scan of thousands of press release headlines each week (PR Newswire & Business Wire) – kind of like a PR Twitter stream. All of it together helps me get a feel for trends and shifts in the digital/business landscape. Finding out how Zappos, for example, is using Twitter so effectively tells me we’ll see more Brands jumping on the Twitter train soon.

  • http://www.consumerpassion.com Jeff Crites

    Interesting take on noise vs news. I’ve always been an information junkie, a mix of noise and news I guess. I enjoy skimming through numerous blog posts and info bits from Twitter each day. I also enjoy magazine articles – things that aren’t time sensitive – that go behind the scenes or look over the horizon for trends. And when I can, I do a quick scan of thousands of press release headlines each week (PR Newswire & Business Wire) – kind of like a PR Twitter stream. All of it together helps me get a feel for trends and shifts in the digital/business landscape. Finding out how Zappos, for example, is using Twitter so effectively tells me we’ll see more Brands jumping on the Twitter train soon.

  • Damien Hogan

    Don’t lose site of the difference between why you trawl the noise and why some of us subscribe to your output. There is very little value for me in getting the mere fact of the existence of an earthquake a few minutes before someone else. I’m certainly not subscribed to your feeds for geological information.

    It’s kinda interesting to confirm that the Internet has become real-time – but it’s been real-time for years now – twitter just makes it easier to notice.

    The greatest service any noise trawler can provide me is to filter the noise. Your filter is your value proposition. Be very careful how you play with the filter’s settings.

  • Damien Hogan

    Don’t lose site of the difference between why you trawl the noise and why some of us subscribe to your output. There is very little value for me in getting the mere fact of the existence of an earthquake a few minutes before someone else. I’m certainly not subscribed to your feeds for geological information.

    It’s kinda interesting to confirm that the Internet has become real-time – but it’s been real-time for years now – twitter just makes it easier to notice.

    The greatest service any noise trawler can provide me is to filter the noise. Your filter is your value proposition. Be very careful how you play with the filter’s settings.

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  • Steve

    You’ve hung out with the world’s top journalists? Really? Which ones?

    Walt Bogdanich, or Jake Hooker? Amy Harmon? Jo Becker ? Barton Gellman? Steve Fainaru? Gene Weingarten? Steven Pearlstein? Brett Blackledge? Kenneth Weiss? Usha Lee McFarling?
    Susan Schmidt? James Grimaldi?, R. Jeffrey Smith? Dana Priest? James Risen? Eric Lichtblau? Joseph Kahn? jim Yardley? Dele Olojede?

    If you are going to make such a bold claim, at least name some names.

  • Steve

    You’ve hung out with the world’s top journalists? Really? Which ones?

    Walt Bogdanich, or Jake Hooker? Amy Harmon? Jo Becker ? Barton Gellman? Steve Fainaru? Gene Weingarten? Steven Pearlstein? Brett Blackledge? Kenneth Weiss? Usha Lee McFarling?
    Susan Schmidt? James Grimaldi?, R. Jeffrey Smith? Dana Priest? James Risen? Eric Lichtblau? Joseph Kahn? jim Yardley? Dele Olojede?

    If you are going to make such a bold claim, at least name some names.

  • Steve

    And Ted Kennedy’s family and friends new about his seizure before you did. What’s your point?

  • Steve

    And Ted Kennedy’s family and friends new about his seizure before you did. What’s your point?

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  • matt

    this is just basic communication theory.

    information -> transmitter -> communication channel -> receiver

    The channel acts as a filter.

    You are pointing out that Google News acts as a filter prior to the transmission as their methodology slects only “reputable” or “highly regarded” information sources.

    I’m guessing that most readers of your blog, greater social/online network, possess sufficient receiver processing power to parse the noise, so therefore they desire a high bandwidth transmitter and communication channel.

    However, I don’t believe that everyone wishes to do the receiver post-processing and often prefer news which is easier to digest.

    thanks for the post

  • matt

    this is just basic communication theory.

    information -> transmitter -> communication channel -> receiver

    The channel acts as a filter.

    You are pointing out that Google News acts as a filter prior to the transmission as their methodology slects only “reputable” or “highly regarded” information sources.

    I’m guessing that most readers of your blog, greater social/online network, possess sufficient receiver processing power to parse the noise, so therefore they desire a high bandwidth transmitter and communication channel.

    However, I don’t believe that everyone wishes to do the receiver post-processing and often prefer news which is easier to digest.

    thanks for the post

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  • Cuthbert

    If I were a real news junkie then I’d go for the noise. I’d be willing to expend the energy required to spot trends and basically keep up with the noise. As it is, I’m not willing, which is why news is usually enough for me. I only want to keep up enough to consume the strained, filtered and processed product.

    If I may use a crude analogy: It’s like having someone else masticate my food before I eat it. I lose out on the nutrients and most of the enjoyment. (Not to mention it’s disgusting.) But it saves me the trouble of having to chew. If I had the time or energy or willingness, then of course I’d rather do it myself.

  • Cuthbert

    If I were a real news junkie then I’d go for the noise. I’d be willing to expend the energy required to spot trends and basically keep up with the noise. As it is, I’m not willing, which is why news is usually enough for me. I only want to keep up enough to consume the strained, filtered and processed product.

    If I may use a crude analogy: It’s like having someone else masticate my food before I eat it. I lose out on the nutrients and most of the enjoyment. (Not to mention it’s disgusting.) But it saves me the trouble of having to chew. If I had the time or energy or willingness, then of course I’d rather do it myself.

  • http://www.straightrecord.com/ straightrecord

    as a professional, seasoned print journalist, i’d like to tell your readers you are full of crap. a tour of a newspaper’s satellite printing plant does not mean you have “hung out” with top journalists. sorry to use this language, but you are somewhat pathetic. as a simple example, a real journalist knows the difference between “who” and “that,” or at least his or her editor does. you really don’t have a bit of a handle on the news business. your prime sources of daily news are on the bottom rung of information. just what are you trying to achieve? from what i see, you, as with most of americans, haven’t the foggiest idea about what news is or what the news business is about. you might want to give it up. while you’re at it, review some of your 7th grade grammar lessons.
    and sorry, steve, you didn’t list a single “real journalist.” most of the best are not readily known to the general public because we don’t seek tabloid-cable tv attention.

  • http://www.straightrecord.com straightrecord

    as a professional, seasoned print journalist, i’d like to tell your readers you are full of crap. a tour of a newspaper’s satellite printing plant does not mean you have “hung out” with top journalists. sorry to use this language, but you are somewhat pathetic. as a simple example, a real journalist knows the difference between “who” and “that,” or at least his or her editor does. you really don’t have a bit of a handle on the news business. your prime sources of daily news are on the bottom rung of information. just what are you trying to achieve? from what i see, you, as with most of americans, haven’t the foggiest idea about what news is or what the news business is about. you might want to give it up. while you’re at it, review some of your 7th grade grammar lessons.
    and sorry, steve, you didn’t list a single “real journalist.” most of the best are not readily known to the general public because we don’t seek tabloid-cable tv attention.

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  • lemukenfi

    Since noise is where the future trends and actions hide, wouldn’t it be interesting to implement that behaviour in regular business. Thinking of NPM Noise Process Management as a challenge for companies.

    http://bpmedge.wordpress.com

  • lemukenfi

    Since noise is where the future trends and actions hide, wouldn’t it be interesting to implement that behaviour in regular business. Thinking of NPM Noise Process Management as a challenge for companies.

    http://bpmedge.wordpress.com

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  • http://www.learnfobia.com/ John Elar

    its quite cool without noise :d

  • http://www.learnfobia.com John Elar

    its quite cool without noise :d

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  • http://trancemist.net/blog/ TranceMist

    Fantastic analysis and explanation of the two, Robert.

    Really insightful. Great job.

  • http://trancemist.net/blog/ TranceMist

    Fantastic analysis and explanation of the two, Robert.

    Really insightful. Great job.